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[Music]

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Okay, take it. I need

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Welcome to the very first edition of

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Sputnik, orbiting the world with me,

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George Galloway, and me, Gayatri,

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otherwise known as Mrs.

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Galloway. Every week through the lens of

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London, we'll be covering the stories

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that made it into the news and those

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that didn't, but should have. It'll be

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news from elsewhere and from a different

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point of view, ours, but yours, too.

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Through our social media portal, you can

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supply us with your views on Twitter at

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RT_Sputnik or from the streets of

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London, where we are out and about every

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week to listen to your voice. His name

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was Bond, James Bond. Licensed to kill,

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regularly shaken, but never stirred. He

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was on her majesty's secret service. but

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is a service that's secret no more. His

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commander, whose very existence it was

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an offense to divulge, used to sign

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himself, see, and if I had told you his

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real name, I would have had to kill you.

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Though the service was often more Austin

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Powers than James Bond, its very shroud

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of mystery lent it an aura of glamour.

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Now well and truly lost after a parade

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of cockups, conspiracies, and farce.

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Last week, the shroud was fully removed

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for the first time when the heads of

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Britain's domestic and foreign secret

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intelligence services were forced to

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appear in public before the cameras in

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front of a parade of British MPs. And

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look at those faces. Austin Powers

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indeed at MI5. At GCHQ, we had Seran

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Lobam. All hay, no needle. And over at

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MI6, Sir John Sawyers is nothing much to

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see. Well, that's really unprecedented.

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From the shadow to the spotlight, what

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led to that? Well, the the approximate

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cause is Edward Snowden safely ensconced

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in Russia and having spilled the beans

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which are now spilling all over the

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place. They're causing a crisis between

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allies, the United States and Britain,

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with France and Germany. And uh

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Snowden's revelations, of which there

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are more to come, have cast this

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spotlight, on the whole spying game, and

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the public and certainly the parliament

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feels utterly betrayed and bypassed and

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powerless to some extent to do anything

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about it. So in the good old British

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way, a parade of flunkies from the

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intelligence services has appeared

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before a parade of parliamentary

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flunkies. Every one of those people on

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the committee are themselves handpicked,

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security cleared to even be on that

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committee. So there was no chance they

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were going to ask them any difficult

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questions. But the very act of being

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dragged blinking into the light will

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have been very humiliating for the

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formerly secret heads of the British

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secret services. Well, so unimpressive

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were the three spies that Scad Atkins

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tweeted, "These three spy bosses look

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like they work for Centria." To which

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Mega Cries responds, "Are they just

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psies? Not the real spy bosses. They're

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really secret." Well, maybe not psies.

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Definitely pasties. Now, later, we'll be

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talking to legendary British spy writer

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Philip Knightly, formerly a Britain

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Sunday Times, a best-selling author, and

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the man who secured the interview with

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the equally legendary Kim Philby, who

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while serving at the top of British

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Secret Services, was also a colonel in

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the KGB. But first, we sent our own

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sleuth out and about to talk to the

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public about the spying game.

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[Music]

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[Music]

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As you know, it's been revealed that the

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state is spying on its civilians by

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keeping all your searches, all your

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emails, everything the state has all.

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How do you feel about that?

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Um, I guess one shouldn't be surprised

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because you hear it in you see it in

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sci-fi um movies and novels and they

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usually are true. I didn't know they did

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keep a record of absolutely everything.

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It's all in GCHQ now. All my texts, all

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my emails, all your email searches, all

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your email and your internet search. I

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don't feel very good about that. No, I

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feel like my privacy is being invaded. I

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feel violated, but it's something that

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I'm sort of used to. Um because I'm

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Egyptian and we've been used to we've

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we've had a lot of problems with the US

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regarding that matter. It's not there's

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nothing you can do. They'll they'll get

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the information one way. It's how they

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use it. It's the worst thing. Are you

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angry about it?

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Um not really angry. Just just

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I'm not angry that they do it. I'm angry

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in the in the way that they might use it

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because but you can't be a member of

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society these days and and and not get

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away with that. Otherwise, you you

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wouldn't you wouldn't live anywhere. You

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wouldn't have any credit cards. You

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wouldn't be able to interact in any

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way. Now, as I said, my first guest

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today knows all there is to know about

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the spying game. He's Philip Nightly.

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Philip, thanks very much for joining us

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on the first edition of Sputnik. You've

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seen the parade of the heads of the

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security services in front of a parade

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of tame MPs. I must say things ain't

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what they used to be. How h how much

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have they changed? Well, they've changed

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radically. You can't move anywhere these

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days without being

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bugged. Uh everything is they they sweep

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the entire electromagnetic spectrum.

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That's their own phrase. And nothing can

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escape it. And it's very dispiriting

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that people accept it so readily.

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Indeed. Now you of course as I said

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earlier wrote Philby the master spy and

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the second oldest profession. You looked

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at spying in the 20th century. What are

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the biggest changes between spying in

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the 20th century and spying in the 21st?

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The use of computers.

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uh the National Security Agency in the

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United States measures its computers in

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acres rather than number of

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machines and they sweep the entire

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electromagnetic spectrum. They there's

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nothing can escape them. But is it any

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more effective? I mean in the days you

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were writing about spies left messages

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on paper in dead letter drops and uh

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shadowed each other, followed them

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around. Were they more effective now or

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less effective? less effective because

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the people would not accept back in the

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the good old days of spying that anybody

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could be so interested in their private

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affairs they would bug them or to

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examine them and what they were doing or

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and bugging the entire electromagnetic

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spectrum has reached a stage now where a

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spy is not only content with sweeping

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the ether for all the stuff that's there

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but is doing it on a professional basis.

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Nobody there are no isms anymore. Uh, a

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real spy these days is a young man who

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is interested only in putting together a

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professional, professionally run uh, spy

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organization uh, and selling it to the

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the material he's got to the highest

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bidder. The people that you were writing

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about came from a certain class in

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British society and they were very few

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in number. The security services were

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numbered probably in their hundreds uh

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at the beginning, maybe scores at the

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very beginning, but now of course these

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intelligence services have ballooned out

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of all proportion, out of all

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recognition. Yes, they're the greatest

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20th century great growth industry. I

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mean, you're on record as saying that

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the whole thing is a a contract

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basically. Yes. because governments

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found long while ago that it was much

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easier to control a population if that

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population was imbued with a little bit

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of fear. Uh and once they realize

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that every everything that they they've

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aimed at since has been to enhance that

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fear and make it more difficult for an

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ordinary citizen to keep any secrets at

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all. These chaps now at the head,

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they're not exactly James Bonds, are

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they? I mean, some one of our Twitter uh

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feeds uh said that they look more like

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the men who run Centrica or British Gas.

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Uh were they legendary figures before?

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Were they men of militarybearing, more

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impressive perhaps than they look today?

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I think so in some ways. I mean, I

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admire Philby, for example, because he

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was a man who made a commitment to what

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he believed to be an important political

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cause when he was quite young at

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Cambridge and kept that commitment come

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what

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may. Today's spy is has not got the same

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commitment. Uh he'll sell the material

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that he gathers to any

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buyer and he's not interested in isms,

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communism, capitalism, anything like

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that. He's just interested in the

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material that he can gather and sell.

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One of the things that stuck out for me

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in those vox pops was how fatalistically

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people seem to have accepted all of

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this. Well, not really fatalistic. It's

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just that um they feel powerless. Yeah.

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Under the with the state spying on them.

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It's different from corporate companies

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spying on them. That's what the

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Washington Post revealed in from their

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research. Uh you can you can get away

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from companies spying on you. You can

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boycott companies. Uh you can uh not uh

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go to those companies. But where where

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can you go away from from the state? Are

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we done for Phillip? I mean is 1984

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arrived big time and big brothers with

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us and we can't get rid of him. Yes, we

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can't get rid of him. Uh I know that's a

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terribly pessimistic attitude to take

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but computers are so

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allreaching being operated by people who

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are so ammoral that we can't get away

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from them. It's here to stay. Uh and I'm

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very pessimistic about the future of try

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anybody trying to keep a secret about

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anything. They're not they're not likely

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to have been terrified by the

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parliamentary committee. They're not

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likely to have gone away with their

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knees knocking together, quailing before

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the ferocious uh interrogation. Did they

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have more respect for parliament before?

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Were they more afraid of Parliament

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before? Or have they always been

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essentially out of control? Well, I I

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would say the latter. They've always

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been essentially out of control because

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it's see been easier for them to twist

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parliament around their little finger.

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They have no respect for parliament.

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They only have respect for what they

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call the

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realm. Uh it's something that's the deep

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state. Yes, the deep state. It's is

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undefinable and they refuse to define

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it. So we're not going to tell you what

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we consider the state to be the realm of

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the state. Uh but our loyalty is to the

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realm and not the government of the day.

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Fascinating. Philip Nightly, author of

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Philby, KGB, Master Spy and the second

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oldest profession. Thanks very much for

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joining us here on Sputnik. Now after

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the break, I'll be talking to another

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legendary British newsman, Robert Fox,

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defense correspondent with London's

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Evening Standard on the eve of the

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centinery of the First World War. We'll

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be right back. Welcome back to Sputnik.

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Now, every year in Britain in November,

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there is a wave of solemn commemoration

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of the end of the First World War.

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There's a minute silence throughout the

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land. People wear poppies and

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increasingly there's a great deal of

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pressure to wear them if you're anybody

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at all in public life. And everyone

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solemnly remembers the death of millions

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of people in what they call the Great

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War 1914 to 18. However, this year it

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will have special importance because on

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January 1 next year, the British

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government has allocated 300 million

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pounds for commemorative events of the

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centinery of World War I. They clearly

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intend to locate that war in a spectrum

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of honorable British military

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engagements. Indeed, they will call it a

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victory. It's my point of view that the

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First World War was perhaps the greatest

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crime ever committed by Britain's ruling

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elite on its own people. Lions were sent

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to their death in their hundreds of

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thousands, sometimes scores of thousands

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in a single day. Lions led by donkeys.

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So, we sent Gatri out onto the streets

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of London again. Gatri. Yes, indeed. And

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of course, I saw a lot of people wearing

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their puppies. Uh, and so I gathered

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their opinions. Let's have a look. Next

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year is going to be the centinery of the

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First World War. So, there's going to be

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a lot of celebration about that. How do

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you feel about that? Uh, I don't think

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it's something that should be

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celebrated. Um, I think it's tragic war

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completely. I just feel sorry for all

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the soldiers to be honest with you. I

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don't think it's anything to celebrate.

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Just a waste of millions of lives. Yeah,

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absolutely. Yeah. I think better to

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celebrate the end of it rather than the

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beginning. Yeah, I think you I think in

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a way you have got to celebrate because

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it shows that you have got to have a

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certain amount of respect for it and I

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think celebrating it shows that we have

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respect for it. Well, I mean not the

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celebration I would say. I mean it's

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more just to commemorate probably a

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commemoration to uh say sorry for the

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people who lost their lives over there.

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I think it's uh distasteful. Um, I think

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it should be more in line with like

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Remembrance Sunday, uh, where it's a

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little bit more individual rather than a

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national celebration type

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thing. Now, my next guest knows all

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there is to know about the arts of war

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and indeed the history of it. He's the

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legendary British newsman, the Evening

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Standards war correspondent, Robert Fox.

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Robert, thanks for joining me on

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Sputnik. You heard uh mixed views from

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the public there. Uh my thesis, I'll be

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candid, is that the first world war

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represented a kind of crime, a giant war

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crime against the people of this country

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and other countries. A quarrel between

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cousins that could have been resolved

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around the breakfast table at Bal Moral.

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That's very interesting thesis and I

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think it counts for about 0 0.1% of the

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whole argument. Uh, as you say, it was a

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massive gamecher. I would agree with

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you. It was an absolutely unnecessary

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war. More than a crime, it's worse. It

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was a folly. It was a terrible, terrible

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folly that how they pushed into this.

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People talked about the coming great

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war. People talked about the need to

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construct a coming great peace. But

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there's uh another side to it, George,

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which I'm surprised that you didn't

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raise, but which we will do is uh if you

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if if you look at particularly somebody

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like uh the chancellor Angela Merkel,

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Angela Merkel barely wants even to

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mention the great war and I do

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understand why she's using she thinks

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and it's a very good argument that the

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follyies and madness of the great war

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and the sense of unfair defeat in

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Germany and not exclusively like that

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led to an even greater war in terms of

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numerical humanity destroyed in the

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second world war in other words led to

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the rise of fascism and what I think

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came out from your vox pop which is

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related to that which is so interesting

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is that only but one said let's

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commemorate this for goodness sake let's

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not celebrate

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00:17:05,959 --> 00:17:12,559
this but people before the great war

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were celebrating war famously the

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futurists

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famously the poet Gabriela Danunio in

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Italy and would you believe it in the

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non big non-fiction prize in the UK this

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very week what has won the prize a book

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about Danunio which I'm absolutely

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00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:35,200
horrified by uh by by the way and there

390
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was this militancy in the German

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military machine the you know there was

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the plan deset there was the Schlieffen

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plan there was the plan that said

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by surgical use they would say to use an

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anacronism of mechanized war we can

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capture Paris it'll all be over and then

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it's Deutseland Uberales and then we can

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set the new industrial system it was

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letting loose this new mechanized group

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00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:03,520
of horsemen of the apocalypse of

401
00:18:01,120 --> 00:18:06,799
mechanized industrial war because as

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00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:08,880
Eric Hobsborn the the noted and terrific

403
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Marxist historian said this was the

404
00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,280
beginning of the long war this was a war

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that didn't really finish until the

406
00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:17,200
1990s and that is why it is so terrible.

407
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It has to be looked at but you can't

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ignore it and you can't belittle it. It

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00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:23,440
is part of our collective memory. I'm as

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00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:25,919
passionate as you are about it but it's

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very important to look this beast in the

412
00:18:25,919 --> 00:18:31,039
eye and look at it for what it is. The

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00:18:28,799 --> 00:18:35,200
reason we use the word celebrate is

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there will be a definite attempt to uh

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link it to World War II. A truly great

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war, but one which had to be fought and

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in which we were on the right side and

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stood for a period alone. Truly our

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finest hour. But the first world war

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wasn't like that. Isn't it the case the

421
00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:55,360
Second World War was the good war and

422
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:57,520
the first world war the bad war?

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00:18:55,360 --> 00:18:59,919
Oversimplistic, George. I'm sorry.

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00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:02,559
Because did it have to be fought that

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that that that I I would argue uh the

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00:19:02,559 --> 00:19:10,400
Second World War by the time we got to

427
00:19:05,799 --> 00:19:13,840
1940? Probably yes. But I take the

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00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:16,480
thesis of my old friend and tutor AJP

429
00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:18,080
Taylor. Allan's point is this and I

430
00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:20,880
think it applies to the First World War

431
00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:23,919
in its time as well. really with the

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00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:25,679
Munich system uh in a way you could see

433
00:19:23,919 --> 00:19:29,039
when the Munich settlement the piece of

434
00:19:25,679 --> 00:19:30,880
paper appeasement over uh Czechoslovakia

435
00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:32,640
was achieved he said in a way that was

436
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:35,039
achievement of diplomacy it's rather

437
00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:37,280
like Iran talks at the moment you've got

438
00:19:35,039 --> 00:19:38,799
to put in the basement the ground floor

439
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,640
and build on it and they should have

440
00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:43,280
built on it they didn't know how to do

441
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:45,200
it then the whole system broke down

442
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:48,400
arguably you could have avoided the

443
00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:50,880
first world war and very likely had they

444
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:52,640
been clever from the very end of the

445
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:55,120
first world war through you could have

446
00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:57,200
avoided the second the second world war.

447
00:19:55,120 --> 00:19:59,280
We could hindsight's a wonderful

448
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:02,080
wonderful thing and journalists indulge

449
00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:06,360
in it as much as as much as historians

450
00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:10,720
but it was it was a chapter of terrible

451
00:20:06,360 --> 00:20:13,200
terrible mistakes and as usual it's a

452
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,919
wonderful march of folly and and and

453
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:17,200
stupidity and that is what is so

454
00:20:14,919 --> 00:20:19,280
upsetting because I'm very worried about

455
00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,440
the good war thesis by the way because

456
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:24,160
then you say good wars uh the

457
00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:26,240
implication of the studs turk uh oral

458
00:20:24,160 --> 00:20:28,480
histories of is fought by good guys and

459
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:30,640
this perhaps was uh the approach of a

460
00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:33,840
very famous war correspondent like Ernie

461
00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:36,320
Pile GI Joe but as actually Ernie Pile

462
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:38,720
who was a terrific journalist said GI

463
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:40,640
Joe Joe was in the mud and in the pooh

464
00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:42,320
as much as everybody and as much from

465
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:44,000
their commanders I mean sort of things

466
00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:44,960
with the second world war just thinking

467
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,280
we're going to come up to the

468
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commemoration of the D-Day landings the

469
00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:53,280
liberation of Europe they bombed 75,000

470
00:20:50,559 --> 00:20:56,400
French civilians to death in the opening

471
00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:58,360
month and a half of the D-Day uh uh the

472
00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:02,039
D-Day invasion or the D-Day li

473
00:20:58,360 --> 00:21:04,480
liberation. Yes, I'm being contrary. I'm

474
00:21:02,039 --> 00:21:07,039
being I'm being what I was brought up to

475
00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:09,280
be. And I was brought up to just inquire

476
00:21:07,039 --> 00:21:11,919
about the news past, present, and future

477
00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:13,520
and look at it in in the face. There's a

478
00:21:11,919 --> 00:21:15,760
lot of sentimentality that goes with

479
00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:18,480
history. And this is where I agree with

480
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:20,720
you. You will get go from shock andor to

481
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,400
schllock andor. you will get very very

482
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:25,280
sentimental and you get this sort of

483
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:27,200
quai mlin celebratory mood. There's

484
00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:29,679
nothing to celebrate about world war at

485
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:32,880
all except perhaps the liberation of

486
00:21:29,679 --> 00:21:34,400
women and appalling that women can could

487
00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,840
be released into the workplace to

488
00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,120
responsible activity. Then they tried to

489
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:39,280
put the lid on. I'm just talking about

490
00:21:37,120 --> 00:21:42,559
this country uh that it had to happen

491
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:45,039
that way. Why on earth? No, we're at the

492
00:21:42,559 --> 00:21:48,559
uh anniversary of course of the Russian

493
00:21:45,039 --> 00:21:51,440
Revolution. Lenon upon coming to power

494
00:21:48,559 --> 00:21:53,120
opened the books and the secret dealings

495
00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,880
for example in the Middle East and

496
00:21:53,120 --> 00:21:56,960
people which you're quite right George

497
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,240
because everybody forgets that it wasn't

498
00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,919
just between Britain and France it was

499
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:02,480
Britain France and Russia and the

500
00:21:59,919 --> 00:22:05,200
Guardian. Indeed the Manchester Guardian

501
00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:07,520
uh revealed Lenin's discoveries. Indeed.

502
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:11,360
Indeed. A fantastic interview. You

503
00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:14,559
really are the Dwen of war reporters and

504
00:22:11,360 --> 00:22:17,039
uh and analysts of the grizzly arts of

505
00:22:14,559 --> 00:22:21,280
war. Robert Fox of the Evening Standard

506
00:22:17,039 --> 00:22:21,280
in London. Thank you for joining us on

507
00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:27,360
Sputnik. Well, at this point in the

508
00:22:24,559 --> 00:22:30,840
show, we listen to you through our

509
00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:33,280
internet portal, on Twitter,

510
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:35,919
RT_Sputnik. We receive your point of

511
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,600
view and Guyatri processes it. How has

512
00:22:35,919 --> 00:22:39,360
it been this week? Well, it's been very

513
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:41,919
very busy. People have been supplying us

514
00:22:39,360 --> 00:22:43,440
with a lot a lot of feedback uh on the

515
00:22:41,919 --> 00:22:45,679
question how they feel about the first

516
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:48,880
world war. For example, Anthony

517
00:22:45,679 --> 00:22:51,280
Rodriguez says, "My view of World War I

518
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:54,000
is that the last time the world went to

519
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:57,360
war based on monarchist ties, ancient

520
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:59,360
treaties, family and blood links." India

521
00:22:57,360 --> 00:23:01,520
adds to him saying, "If only Queen

522
00:22:59,360 --> 00:23:03,200
Victoria had still been alive, she could

523
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,720
have put her grandsons across the knee

524
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:06,640
and spanked them." Well, that's a very

525
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:08,400
good point. It was two cousins. The king

526
00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:10,480
and the Kaiser were cousins with the

527
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:12,320
same grandmother, the English Queen

528
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:14,400
Victoria. If only she could have sorted

529
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:16,480
it out around the dinner table. I also

530
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:18,320
asked the people uh how they feel about

531
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,360
spying, whether they feel threatened and

532
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:24,720
whether their internet behavior has

533
00:23:20,360 --> 00:23:27,440
changed. And um well, a bit of the same

534
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:30,080
u response from the streets of London.

535
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:32,320
Saul Hudson, for example, says, "Never

536
00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,320
labored under the illusion that our mail

537
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,400
and phone calls were not being

538
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:38,960
monitored. All governments do it well.

539
00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:41,679
But the gathering hay, as it was put in

540
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:44,240
the parliamentary session, if someone

541
00:23:41,679 --> 00:23:47,120
had said before the internet existed,

542
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:49,919
that every single letter you ever write

543
00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:52,799
or receive will be opened by a

544
00:23:49,919 --> 00:23:54,240
government agent and copied and stored.

545
00:23:52,799 --> 00:23:56,559
There would have been a revolution on

546
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:59,840
the streets of Britain. I'm amazed that

547
00:23:56,559 --> 00:24:01,360
people have gone so calmly, quietly into

548
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,880
this good night. Well, perhaps because

549
00:24:01,360 --> 00:24:04,640
at the time it was physical. Yeah, it

550
00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:06,080
was really had to open it. opened the

551
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,840
seal and now everything's virtual.

552
00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:11,120
Everything our identities are all out

553
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:12,799
there indeed. Martin adds, uh, it gives

554
00:24:11,120 --> 00:24:14,880
those in power a false sense of

555
00:24:12,799 --> 00:24:17,520
security. Too much data for them to deal

556
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,880
with. # lose it on a train anyway. Well,

557
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:20,400
I mean, they are. They say they're

558
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,480
gathering all the hay so that they can

559
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,320
find the needle. But so many times they

560
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:26,480
don't find any needle even though the

561
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:28,240
needle is out there and and and an idiot

562
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:31,679
in a hurry could have spotted it. The

563
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:34,320
Woolitch murder uh for example uh the

564
00:24:31,679 --> 00:24:38,559
person accused alleged to have committed

565
00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:40,880
that awful murder was preaching every

566
00:24:38,559 --> 00:24:44,360
Friday and Saturday in the main streets

567
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:46,559
of South London this message of hate and

568
00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:48,640
fanaticism. Yet he doesn't appear to

569
00:24:46,559 --> 00:24:50,640
have been under any surveillance whilst

570
00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:53,760
you, me and everyone else here in this

571
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:56,240
studio is under surveillance. Our hay is

572
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:58,480
being gathered and looked at. Nabila Ali

573
00:24:56,240 --> 00:25:00,240
however thinks that every country must

574
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,480
be sensitive about his security. So

575
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:04,720
what's wrong about that? Well, everybody

576
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:07,440
needs security. But if you sacrifice

577
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:10,640
liberty for security, you'll end up with

578
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:12,640
neither liberty nor security. So said

579
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:15,799
Benjamin Franklin, one of the founding

580
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:18,720
fathers of the good old United States of

581
00:25:15,799 --> 00:25:20,799
America. That though is all that we have

582
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:23,200
got time for. I hope you enjoyed the

583
00:25:20,799 --> 00:25:25,440
first edition of Sputnik and that you'll

584
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,600
come aboard with us next week at the

585
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:31,039
same time. So, please keep your tweets

586
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:34,480
coming at RT Sputnik. Goodbye from me,

587
00:25:31,039 --> 00:25:37,640
Gay and from me, George Galloway. It's

588
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:37,640
been marvelous.

589
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:44,029
[Music]