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[Music]

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Okay, thank you. I need

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Welcome to Sputnik orbiting the world

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with me George Galloway and me Gayatri.

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It isn't every day we have the privilege

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of a president on the show. This is no

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ordinary president, but the president of

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a land whose people have been ethnically

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cleansed from their homeland to make way

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for a US war base and on which the

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torture of kidnapped people from around

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the world appears to have taken place

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and a base given to the US military by

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us, the British. It is of course Diego

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Garcia, part of the Teos Islands,

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highlighted on the show when we

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interviewed British TV host and human

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rights campaigner Ben Fergle in a

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landmark interview. Today we can go one

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better and welcome onto the Sputnik the

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man chosen by the Chugosians to

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represent them on the world stage their

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president Alan

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Vincatasen. President, thank you for

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joining us. I'm struck by the British

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Union flag on your lapel. Uh you live of

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course in Sussex like thousands of

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others of your exiled

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compatriots. Don't you feel a little bit

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bitter about the British? Why are you

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flying their flag?

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Well, uh, Garcia, my homeland is

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still a British overseas territory and,

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uh, I wanted to remain such for more

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years. Uh, because, uh, we were exiled

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between

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1965

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1973. Uh, we wanted to remain a a

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British overseas

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territory because the UK has got

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responsibility to resettle us on our

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homeland. Indeed, they do. So this crime

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took place mainly under a Labor

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government in the 1960s. How do you

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think today's Conservative prime

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minister views your flight? Uh we

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submitted a memorandum to the prime

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minister before the general election

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asking him to uh give us our right to

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return in a pilot resettlement. Erh the

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problems that we have had is that there

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was no uh clear indication about the

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demand on the number of chagosians

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wanted to return. Certainly uh the cost

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is a bit uncertain. Uh the government

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has replied that they will need uh to do

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more works so that a final decision can

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be made. Now you've produced this uh

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book the flight to freedom. Tell us

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what's in it. The book uh the flight to

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freedom is about the story when I came

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for the first time with the first group

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in the UK uh for a better life, a new

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life running away from poverty uh which

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we

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were made to suffer in Mauritius uh by

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the UK uh government. So the book

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relates how I orchestrated the coming

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the migration of our people in the

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United Kingdom. You had uh the right to

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do so of course at the time not a right

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that many people would uh would have

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today. What's happened to your people

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since they were turfed out to make way

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for this American war base?

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We were forced in a abject poverty in

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Maitius. We we were considered as

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secondclass citizen there. The state of

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Mauritius is having an issue with

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regards to sovereignty over our

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homeland. They want sovereignty from the

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UK. Uh and that's why I'm here to fight

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for the cause of my people because I

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believe uh this is our country. It

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should remain uh a a UK overseas

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territory and we as UK overseas uh

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territory uh citizens we need to be able

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uh to return uh as such a citizen in our

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homeland and why can't you return? Are

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you physically barred? Does your

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passport preclude you? How do they

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actually bar you? We are British

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citizens with a British passport. But uh

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because of the military base, the US

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military base uh uh in our homeland, it

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makes it impossible for us to return.

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There are uh several orders in council

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that have been uh done in this country

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uh to prevent us from returning and

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there is still another

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one. But uh we continue to campaign uh

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on our rights of return. So uh recently

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uh the conservative government uh

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appointed the firm KPMG to do a

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feasibility uh study on return. The

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feasibility study shows clearly that

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there is no legal barrier to our return

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except that the government must invest

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the money that is needed for a pilot

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resettlement. And uh I think that's a

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way forward. That's a moral way forward

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for the UK otherwise we we cannot stay

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uh continuously in exile from our

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homeland. The lease for the US air base

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uh on the islands is about to expire

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next year. Is this somehow stopping or

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bringing you more hope to return to the

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islands?

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Uh the the lease uh will uh will

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continue for another 25 years. It will

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not stop uh next year. Uh if the UK or

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the US want to stop uh this

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agreement then they will have to

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renegotiate it or it will come to an

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end. Whereas if both parties uh want to

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continue there there will be uh no

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negotiation. Yeah. And I believe uh this

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is the right time for the UK government

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to uh do the necessary to allow us back

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and certainly to invest uh the money

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that is needed for a pilot resettlement.

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uh which is uh a the capital cost is

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below 60 million and uh I believe also

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that the the the Americans got a moral

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duty also uh to chip in some money uh

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for a pilot resettlement on Jgo Garcia.

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The situation that we have is that we

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have a government that needs to make

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decision and they need to make the

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decision quickly because our old people,

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the old natives are dying. Yeah. and uh

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I'm amongst the last generations uh of

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natives. So it is uh very important that

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uh we uh we be able to to return and and

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with the changes that this government is

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bringing certainly in giving more powers

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to Scotland and to uh Wales and all

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these changes that are being brought uh

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in this parliament. So I think it is it

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is a moral duty of this government to

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allow us uh to return. Uh when Ben Fogle

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was here, he painted this extraordinary

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picture of the houses that your people

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had been forced to leave now being

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inhabited by the kind of international

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jetet uh boat yacht owners stopping off,

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living in your houses for however long

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and then sailing on to their next

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destination. So there clearly is no as

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it were physical reason why people

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cannot live in these houses uh

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preferably the people whose houses they

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are rather than international jet

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setters. What's to stop? Is there

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anything to stop a number of us just

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going there? Uh me, you and a few

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hundred uh chosians from Cwley. Uh could

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they stop us if we did it?

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Yes. Uh the the the u there is a legal

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barrier uh now uh because of the uh

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orders in council. So if for example we

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take a boat uh or a plane you can't land

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there uh and a boat you can't you can't

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get there without the

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permission. This is which navy would

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intercept you the British or the US?

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That would be uh the uh British and the

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US. Both even though you're a British

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citizen effectually. Yes, we have. That

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would be very embarrassing for the prime

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minister, I must say. Yes, we we have.

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That makes it all the more attractive to

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me as an idea.

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Yes, I I I think this is this is

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something that uh if this government

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doesn't uh do uh their best to resettle

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s as uh quickly. I think that's the last

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resort that as as a people will have to

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will have to do. Yes. It' be a kind of

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reverse boat. people, people leaving

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Europe to go back to their homeland and

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the European Navy trying to stop them.

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That's that's what I am asking. I'm

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asking this government to allow us to

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let us return. Let us leave the UK for

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good to go in our country. There are

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many people coming to this country. We

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came to They're always complaining about

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it. They're always complaining about

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chaps your color coming here. Exactly.

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This would be a reverse. Yes. We want a

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law. We want a new orders in council

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allow us to return to our homeland.

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That's simple as that. But the

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government must foot the bill. Of

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course. Does anyone uh champion your

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cause? The government is one thing. Have

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you persuaded the opposition such as it

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is in the British Parliament to adopt

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your cause?

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I I think the the difficulty which the

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opposition

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uh has has had in in uh in the past is

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that all happened under Howard Wilson

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and uh this government has done things

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right in 1982 when they paid peanut

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compensation but they tried to do

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something and it is this conservative

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government also that has appointed KPMG

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to do the visibility study and I think

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uh this government got the the the right

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uh timing and the the the right decision

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uh they they can do it well I must tell

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you if you're ever organizing an

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expedition to

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reclaim Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean

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I want to be on board I'll be one of

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your deck hands on the flagship ship as

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we go back. Guyatri too, she's from uh

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roughly very roughly that part of the

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world. That's going to be great because

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we are asking to return to our homeland

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in a very peaceful way and we want the

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government to do the right thing. We

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want everybody to do the right thing so

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that return is done smoothly. But if

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this government says that there will be

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no return, no pilot resettlement,

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nothing, I think that's the only

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alternative that we have uh into our own

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hands. How can people help you? How do

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they contact you? They can contact me uh

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on I'm on Twitter and I'm on Facebook.

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Uh they can contact me and uh certainly

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and there's a support

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group support group. They're doing a

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great job I must say. doing very very

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good job with the help of Benfogle and

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and Philip Agregori. So I think it's um

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I think we we we we got a chance here

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and uh I think the UK will need to do

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some moral thing. Thank you very much,

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Mr. President. You're

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welcome. After the break, the terrifying

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advance of the most savage and

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destructive army since Jeniskan, ISIS,

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now just 60 miles from Baghdad and

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steadily advancing on Damascus,

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controlling cities as far apart as Certe

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in Libya and Boro in northern Nigeria.

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Don't miss it.

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Welcome back to Sputnik. The ancient

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Roman amphitheater in which I have

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myself stood in Palmira in Syria became

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like some ancient Roman bloodbath, the

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site of mass executions last week when

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the ISIS Visigothths took control of the

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fortress town. ISIS now approaching the

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first anniversary of the declaration of

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their caliphate. Yes, it's only been 12

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months. celebrated in advance with the

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00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:19,920
conquering of Ramadi, capital of Anbar

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province in Iraq, just 60 miles from

274
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Baghdad and in Palmira in Syria, home of

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one of the world's greatest

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archaeological treasures. They are

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beginning to look unstoppable in both

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countries and a growing menace elsewhere

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too. Certainly, if what has been fielded

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against them to date is the best there

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is, they are not going to be stopped.

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And a growing question is does the West

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and Israel actually want to stop them?

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And if not, why not? Joining us to

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discuss the threat is the brightest Arab

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woman analyst of them all, Hafsa Ka

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Mustafa. Hafsa, thanks for coming back

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on board the Sputnik. The last time we

289
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spoke, uh, this was a threat, but a far

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distant one. Now, it's a clear and

291
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present danger that certainly in Syria,

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it may now be winning the war and in

293
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Iraq, it may now be uh unvanquishable in

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the areas it now holds. Is that how you

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see it? Sadly, it is. Uh it's been a

296
00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:25,680
pattern uh it's been an ongoing pattern

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since the US have set foot in Iraq. You

298
00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:30,320
know, if you look at it in a scientific

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way, wherever the US spread, ISIS,

300
00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:35,519
wherever US tread, ISIS has spread and

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they've increased in potency. They're

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they've taken over key strongholds. So,

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I think it is very look is very much

304
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:44,480
looking as if ISIS is there to stay and

305
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:46,880
it's very much a force to be reckoned

306
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with. So, while I was here last time, we

307
00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:51,279
were talking about a rag tag army that

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really didn't have much much focus. They

309
00:14:51,279 --> 00:14:55,600
were coming from all over the place. But

310
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now we're seeing a very strong military

311
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force that is making major gains in some

312
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of the most key places of the Middle

313
00:14:59,839 --> 00:15:03,680
East. So yes, they are very much a

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threat and they're looking as if they're

315
00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:09,360
here to stay. Let's take Syria first of

316
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all. Uh for a long time it looked like

317
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:15,920
the Syrian regime and its army, which

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fought very heroically, sustained huge

319
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losses, remained loyal to the state, had

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the beating of ISIS. What's tipped the

321
00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:27,360
balance? Why are they now effectively in

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control of more of Syria than President

323
00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:31,199
Bashar is? Well, this is the very

324
00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:34,000
strange thing about what's been

325
00:15:31,199 --> 00:15:35,600
happening in the past 6 months alone. Uh

326
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up until four, you know, for the best

327
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part of four years, we've been hearing

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Assad is going. Assad has got only a

329
00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:43,920
month to go. Assad is is is on the ex is

330
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,680
on the exit. And yet, he has remained

331
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and he has become even more popular

332
00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:50,000
amongst Syrians. And at this crucial

333
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time where he's actually inflicting huge

334
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:56,639
losses on ISIS come a US-led coalition

335
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supposedly designed to weaken ISIS. And

336
00:15:56,639 --> 00:16:00,399
yet what have we seen in the past month

337
00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,560
alone? We've seen that a coalition of

338
00:16:00,399 --> 00:16:04,959
the most important and fearsome armies

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00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:07,199
on the planet have actually strengthened

340
00:16:04,959 --> 00:16:09,360
ISIS. So what has what we've seen as a

341
00:16:07,199 --> 00:16:11,199
result is that Syria, the Syrian army,

342
00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:14,000
which as you say has fought heroically

343
00:16:11,199 --> 00:16:17,360
against ISIS forces, is actually losing

344
00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:19,680
the ground on many key places in part

345
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:22,480
thanks to the coalition, which is really

346
00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:24,160
strengthening ISIS uh in in Syria. Well,

347
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:26,040
the big question is whether that's

348
00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:28,800
deliberate or uh

349
00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:31,800
inadvertent. Uh I have resisted for

350
00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:34,959
obvious reasons for four long years the

351
00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:38,399
suspicion that this was a deliberate

352
00:16:34,959 --> 00:16:40,959
tactic on the part of the west but I'm

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bound to say I'm saying it here for the

354
00:16:40,959 --> 00:16:48,680
first time on television that I have now

355
00:16:44,839 --> 00:16:52,079
concluded that the coalition which was

356
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:55,040
supposedly set up to end the threat of

357
00:16:52,079 --> 00:16:56,360
ISIS is in fact facilitating it. I give

358
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:59,360
you just one

359
00:16:56,360 --> 00:17:02,800
example. Given that ISIS, the heart

360
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:05,439
eating, head chopping fanatics, now

361
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:08,480
control more than half of Syria, which

362
00:17:05,439 --> 00:17:11,360
is next door to Israel, you would expect

363
00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:14,959
Israel to be jumping up and down uh in

364
00:17:11,360 --> 00:17:17,360
anguish at that prospect. Imagine ISIS,

365
00:17:14,959 --> 00:17:20,400
the califf, Baghdaddy installed in

366
00:17:17,360 --> 00:17:22,400
Damascus next door to them. A terrifying

367
00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:24,160
prospect you might have thought

368
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:26,240
Netanyahu might have been expected at

369
00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:29,200
the United Nations holding up his

370
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:32,559
diagrams pointing up the mortal threat

371
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:35,600
to his state. But we don't have any of

372
00:17:32,559 --> 00:17:38,559
that. In fact, there's not a whisper out

373
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:41,360
of Tel Aviv about the dangers of ISIS

374
00:17:38,559 --> 00:17:43,039
ruling the country next door to them.

375
00:17:41,360 --> 00:17:45,039
What could be the reasons for that?

376
00:17:43,039 --> 00:17:47,039
Well, clearly because ISIS are

377
00:17:45,039 --> 00:17:49,120
destroying the Middle East, weakening

378
00:17:47,039 --> 00:17:50,720
the surrounding countries, weakening the

379
00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:52,400
countries that pose the greatest threat

380
00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:54,880
to Israel, and therefore they're playing

381
00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:57,440
into Israel's game. Now, the one central

382
00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:59,360
thing that is really a major focus for

383
00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,960
the majority of Muslims across the world

384
00:17:59,360 --> 00:18:02,400
is the Palestinian cause and the

385
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:04,400
suffering and the ongoing suffering of

386
00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:06,720
Palestinians. And when you see that the

387
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:08,880
people of ISIS who are claiming in some

388
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:11,200
bizarre way to somehow represent Islam

389
00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:13,039
or Islamic interests have not in any

390
00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:14,960
way, shape or form targeted Israel or

391
00:18:13,039 --> 00:18:16,559
any Israel interest. I think it really

392
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,640
says a lot about the coalition between

393
00:18:16,559 --> 00:18:20,799
the two. And one major one thing that's

394
00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:23,280
been very very striking recently was

395
00:18:20,799 --> 00:18:25,600
that uh ISIS forces well not ISIS forces

396
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:27,840
but the the opposition to Assad which

397
00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:30,720
are fighting alongside Jabet Nusra which

398
00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:33,120
is itself a ally to ISIS have actually

399
00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:35,120
congratulated Israel on its supposedly

400
00:18:33,120 --> 00:18:37,360
independence anniversary. Now that is

401
00:18:35,120 --> 00:18:39,600
utterly shameful. Wherever you stand as

402
00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:41,440
an Arab and as a Syrian and however much

403
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,880
you oppose Assad, there isn't a

404
00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,120
self-respecting Syrian who could

405
00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:47,120
possibly congratulate Israel in any way,

406
00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:49,280
shape or form. And I think that really

407
00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:51,280
just that little information that is,

408
00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:53,120
you know, was swept under the carpet and

409
00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,960
wasn't making the headlines really says

410
00:18:53,120 --> 00:18:56,240
a lot about the alliance between ISIS,

411
00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:59,360
between these terrorists and the state

412
00:18:56,240 --> 00:19:01,919
of Israel. Well, we're now going to,

413
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:04,320
unless there's some spectacular reverse

414
00:19:01,919 --> 00:19:07,280
on the battlefield, we're going to have

415
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:10,960
the emergence of a new state in half of

416
00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:14,480
Syria and a third of Iraq, uh, with the

417
00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:20,440
border between the two obliterated.

418
00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:24,559
uh thus uh buffer state between Iran,

419
00:19:20,440 --> 00:19:28,240
Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Palestine. That

420
00:19:24,559 --> 00:19:30,400
may be one clue uh to what the western

421
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:34,880
countries uh are seeking to achieve

422
00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:37,600
here. This will break the arc or the the

423
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:41,520
arc of resistance if you like uh by

424
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:45,039
which from Iran to Lebanon and across

425
00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:48,480
the border into Palestine uh support for

426
00:19:45,039 --> 00:19:53,520
the Palestinian people was able to be uh

427
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:56,720
conveyed. Um, it's clear though that

428
00:19:53,520 --> 00:20:00,520
whatever ISIS said or didn't say about

429
00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:04,640
the independence of Israel in their

430
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:07,280
ranks, there are some very fanatically

431
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:10,720
uh extreme people.

432
00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:13,520
Are they likely to be demobilized once

433
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:15,600
the war, the current war is over, or

434
00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:18,000
will they want to go on and fight

435
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:21,120
somewhere else? Is Saudi Arabia in

436
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:23,039
danger? Is Israel in danger? I very much

437
00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:24,880
doubt that Saudi Arabia is in danger or

438
00:20:23,039 --> 00:20:27,360
Israel is in danger. For one thing,

439
00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:29,600
Saudi Arabia has been funding uh the

440
00:20:27,360 --> 00:20:31,679
other uh avatar if you want, which is

441
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:33,600
Janus and all the other opposition

442
00:20:31,679 --> 00:20:35,200
parties in Syria. And as we've

443
00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:37,120
discussed, Israel is very much

444
00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:39,919
benefiting from the chaos that is

445
00:20:37,120 --> 00:20:42,320
brought upon by ISIS. Now the what we

446
00:20:39,919 --> 00:20:44,240
have to notice uh in the region the

447
00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:47,200
wider Middle East is that these groups

448
00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:49,520
and similar groups are acting simply uh

449
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:52,240
in the interest of increasing chaos and

450
00:20:49,520 --> 00:20:53,840
warfare in the Muslim world. Now in that

451
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:56,000
part of the world they're claiming that

452
00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:58,000
they're resisting Shia influence. That's

453
00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,600
their that's one of their arguments. But

454
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:01,440
of course what is their argument when

455
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:03,280
you have al-Qaeda in the Maghreb where

456
00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:04,799
there are no uh where are no Sharia

457
00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:07,440
populations in that part of the world.

458
00:21:04,799 --> 00:21:09,840
So really their aim is to just increase

459
00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:12,240
chaos, give Western countries in

460
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:15,520
particular in the US the uh the reason

461
00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:18,080
and the excuse to come in to invade to

462
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:20,000
send in forces to sell more weapons to

463
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:22,080
Saudi Arabia. So what they're doing is

464
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:24,080
really they're giving the opportunity

465
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:26,480
for the Muslim world to collapse and to

466
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:28,559
be destroyed. And every every single

467
00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:30,400
endeavor that they take is actually

468
00:21:28,559 --> 00:21:32,799
going towards that aim which is to

469
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:34,799
fragment the region, leave it weakened

470
00:21:32,799 --> 00:21:36,400
and of course in a weakened wider

471
00:21:34,799 --> 00:21:40,159
weakened Middle East, you have a strong

472
00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:44,400
emerging Israel. What um one of the few

473
00:21:40,159 --> 00:21:46,960
um resisting groups fighting ISIS

474
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:49,360
successfully are the Kurdish women.

475
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:51,760
Yeah. But funny enough, they are being

476
00:21:49,360 --> 00:21:54,640
supported by the US as well. How do you

477
00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:56,799
read that movement? I mean the the role

478
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,840
of of the Kurds in in the Arab world has

479
00:21:56,799 --> 00:22:02,480
been very ambiguous probably because um

480
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:04,240
you know in in the fight in in Iraq it

481
00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:06,559
was they were used against Saddam

482
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:08,960
Hussein. Uh in Turkey they've they've

483
00:22:06,559 --> 00:22:12,000
played again an ambiguous role. It's

484
00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:14,400
very difficult to to actually pinpoint

485
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,559
how to you know how the Kurds are

486
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:18,559
operating. they've been fed a sort of

487
00:22:16,559 --> 00:22:20,320
very anti-Arab propaganda and I think

488
00:22:18,559 --> 00:22:22,640
that's been very central to how they

489
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,960
were strengthened and in with the fall

490
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:28,159
of Saddam Hussein what happened is you

491
00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:30,000
had uh Israel quickly jumping and ally

492
00:22:28,159 --> 00:22:32,080
with many Kurdish leaders saying well

493
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:34,480
actually you know whilst you were being

494
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:36,240
gassed by Saddam Hussein by the Arabs

495
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,919
you know we can come here and help you

496
00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:40,480
so there's been a sort of weird alliance

497
00:22:37,919 --> 00:22:42,640
between Kurdish forces and Israeli

498
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:44,960
forces now with the case of ISIS they

499
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:46,799
only came into fight because ISIS is

500
00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:49,280
threatened certain parts of of Kurd

501
00:22:46,799 --> 00:22:52,400
Kurdish. Well, the only serious effort

502
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:54,960
the United States has made against ISIS

503
00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:58,360
is when there are Kurdish allies have

504
00:22:54,960 --> 00:23:00,280
been threatened in Kobani in uh in

505
00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:03,520
Erbil.

506
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:05,600
Uh you're an Arab woman. An Arab woman

507
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:08,320
who thinks like you, talks like you,

508
00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:10,559
looks like you would have no future

509
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:14,320
under ISIS.

510
00:23:10,559 --> 00:23:18,000
uh the horrific attitude that they have

511
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:20,720
towards women, including justifying

512
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:23,280
multiple rape of Yazidi girls, for

513
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:25,760
example, written by one of their women

514
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:27,440
in their own theoretical journal this

515
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:31,080
month, saying that it was actually

516
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:34,240
Islamic to seize these girls and

517
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:36,640
multiply rape them and claiming that

518
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:38,559
they celebrated when the first of the

519
00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:40,480
slave girls was brought into their

520
00:23:38,559 --> 00:23:43,280
homes.

521
00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:47,120
What a face this is for the Muslims.

522
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:49,440
What a horrific image that's being given

523
00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:51,600
to Islam by these people. Well, I think

524
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:53,679
this is this is exactly it. This is a

525
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:55,840
caricature of evil. I mean, the the

526
00:23:53,679 --> 00:23:58,000
barbarity of ISIS is is unmatched. And

527
00:23:55,840 --> 00:24:00,000
they seem to take pleasure in exposing

528
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:01,600
their depravity in a way that has never

529
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:04,000
been seen before. You know, we know the

530
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,600
armies raped. We know that war is a

531
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,840
nasty thing. We know that horrific

532
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,600
things happen on the battlefield. But

533
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:11,919
what ISIS is doing is actually promoting

534
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:13,760
it and showing it off as something to be

535
00:24:11,919 --> 00:24:15,520
proud of. And this is unheard of. I mean

536
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,960
in in the annals of history, you know,

537
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:19,039
people are ashamed of their the crimes

538
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:22,640
that they commit. So I think ISIS is

539
00:24:19,039 --> 00:24:24,799
really contributing to this image that

540
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:27,200
fuels Islamophobia and particularly in

541
00:24:24,799 --> 00:24:29,039
the West and allows countries such as

542
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,559
Israel or the US say, "Well, look, this

543
00:24:29,039 --> 00:24:32,080
is pretty much what Islam is." Because

544
00:24:30,559 --> 00:24:34,640
of course, whether we like it or not,

545
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:36,799
ISIS is claiming to be the Islamic

546
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:39,039
State. The word Islam is intrinsically

547
00:24:36,799 --> 00:24:41,760
linked to ISIS and therefore it's linked

548
00:24:39,039 --> 00:24:44,240
to what it does and I think ISIS are

549
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:46,480
playing a major role in actually fueling

550
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:49,039
the image a bad image of Islam which in

551
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:50,880
itself fuels Islamophobia.

552
00:24:49,039 --> 00:24:52,559
We're going to have to interview you

553
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:55,200
again because there's so much we didn't

554
00:24:52,559 --> 00:24:59,080
have time to reach there. Hafsa, thank

555
00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:59,080
you very much indeed.

556
00:25:00,159 --> 00:25:04,080
And now it's your turn to tell us what

557
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:07,200
you think through the portals of social

558
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:09,679
media. What's rattling about the fate of

559
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:11,679
the Chagosians? Uh, Stellarance says the

560
00:25:09,679 --> 00:25:13,520
following. Britain is such a free

561
00:25:11,679 --> 00:25:15,840
country, they can't leave it. What a

562
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:18,240
truer test of freedom than that. On the

563
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:21,360
possible working together of ISIS with

564
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:23,039
the West, Paul Hoover says ISIS was

565
00:25:21,360 --> 00:25:24,880
created by the West, so of course

566
00:25:23,039 --> 00:25:26,880
they're hoping their investment pays

567
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:29,200
off. Well, that's all that we've got for

568
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:30,799
this week, which alas means that's the

569
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:33,679
end of the show. You can stay in touch

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00:25:30,799 --> 00:25:35,679
with us on Twitter at RT_Sputnik, and on

571
00:25:33,679 --> 00:25:37,840
Facebook, you can like us on Sputnik on

572
00:25:35,679 --> 00:25:39,679
Russia Today. Goodbye from me, Gayatri,

573
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:42,679
and from me, George Galloway. It's been

574
00:25:39,679 --> 00:25:42,679
marvelous.

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00:25:52,550 --> 00:25:55,619
[Music]