1 00:00:03,310 --> 00:00:10,110 [Music] 2 00:00:06,529 --> 00:00:12,570 I'm George Galloway and I'm Adam Geary 3 00:00:10,110 --> 00:00:15,870 and together we are the history boys 4 00:00:12,570 --> 00:00:18,800 every week on this patreon page we look 5 00:00:15,870 --> 00:00:22,769 at great historical events historical 6 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:26,070 eras historical personalities who have 7 00:00:22,769 --> 00:00:28,199 helped to create the situation we are 8 00:00:26,070 --> 00:00:30,900 now in and if you don't understand how 9 00:00:28,199 --> 00:00:34,590 we got to where we are you'll never be 10 00:00:30,900 --> 00:00:37,730 able to work out how we get out of the 11 00:00:34,590 --> 00:00:42,450 state we are in today we're looking at 12 00:00:37,730 --> 00:00:46,350 Iraq country of just four letters that 13 00:00:42,450 --> 00:00:51,350 has loomed large over the 21st century 14 00:00:46,350 --> 00:00:52,620 and doesn't seem likely to shrink in its 15 00:00:51,350 --> 00:00:58,859 importance 16 00:00:52,620 --> 00:01:02,460 Iraq was an ancient civilization 700 17 00:00:58,859 --> 00:01:04,739 years ago Iraq had the greatest library 18 00:01:02,460 --> 00:01:08,189 in the history of the world when people 19 00:01:04,739 --> 00:01:11,130 like me were painting our faces blue and 20 00:01:08,189 --> 00:01:14,130 living in the forests when the mongols 21 00:01:11,130 --> 00:01:17,400 sacked baghdad it was said that the 22 00:01:14,130 --> 00:01:20,850 river tigris turned to different colors 23 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:24,689 in the same day first with the ink of 24 00:01:20,850 --> 00:01:27,270 the books from that greatest library 25 00:01:24,689 --> 00:01:30,960 that were thrown by the invaders into 26 00:01:27,270 --> 00:01:34,350 the river and second it turned red with 27 00:01:30,960 --> 00:01:37,350 the blood of the defenders a bit like 28 00:01:34,350 --> 00:01:40,740 what happened in shock and awe when 29 00:01:37,350 --> 00:01:43,610 George Bush and Tony Blair destroyed 30 00:01:40,740 --> 00:01:48,390 Iraq all over again 31 00:01:43,610 --> 00:01:53,340 Adam Geary is the history boy I'm just 32 00:01:48,390 --> 00:01:55,979 his apprentice here Adam tell us the 33 00:01:53,340 --> 00:02:00,570 ancient and then we'll move to the 34 00:01:55,979 --> 00:02:02,640 modern history of Iraq well Mesopotamia 35 00:02:00,570 --> 00:02:05,340 as it tends to be called when were 36 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:07,770 looking at ancient history was in many 37 00:02:05,340 --> 00:02:10,459 ways the cradle of civilization along 38 00:02:07,770 --> 00:02:13,260 with China and some of the Indus Valley 39 00:02:10,459 --> 00:02:13,620 civilizations and what today is India 40 00:02:13,260 --> 00:02:16,019 and 41 00:02:13,620 --> 00:02:19,349 Gaston some of the greatest early 42 00:02:16,019 --> 00:02:22,260 civilizations were in Babylon and in 43 00:02:19,349 --> 00:02:25,140 fact the very essence of law as we know 44 00:02:22,260 --> 00:02:29,040 it derives from Iraq the Code of 45 00:02:25,140 --> 00:02:31,860 Hammurabi was Iraqi it was it was 46 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:33,780 authored not far from where bad dad is 47 00:02:31,860 --> 00:02:35,819 today how sad 48 00:02:33,780 --> 00:02:37,890 therefore that this long journey that 49 00:02:35,819 --> 00:02:40,829 we're going to take is one from a 50 00:02:37,890 --> 00:02:43,650 society that gave the world law in its 51 00:02:40,829 --> 00:02:46,859 modern form albeit in the ancient days 52 00:02:43,650 --> 00:02:49,650 to a place torn to shreds by supreme 53 00:02:46,859 --> 00:02:52,950 lawlessness and a disregard for that 54 00:02:49,650 --> 00:02:56,549 spirit of ethics that Hammurabi gave 55 00:02:52,950 --> 00:02:58,409 Iraq Iraq has been conquered and it's 56 00:02:56,549 --> 00:03:01,290 been embraced and it's frankly been 57 00:02:58,409 --> 00:03:03,750 destroyed by many people after the air 58 00:03:01,290 --> 00:03:06,450 of the Babylonians and the Assyrians we 59 00:03:03,750 --> 00:03:08,390 see the Persian Empire and the Roman 60 00:03:06,450 --> 00:03:12,239 Empire competing for influence 61 00:03:08,390 --> 00:03:15,900 throughout the Mesopotamian world Iraq 62 00:03:12,239 --> 00:03:18,239 became a great place again in the age of 63 00:03:15,900 --> 00:03:21,180 the Arab caliphates where for a time 64 00:03:18,239 --> 00:03:24,540 Baghdad was a great center of learning 65 00:03:21,180 --> 00:03:27,269 of mathematics in particular the 66 00:03:24,540 --> 00:03:29,190 invented algebra indeed a wonderful 67 00:03:27,269 --> 00:03:31,650 center of learning during the Islamic 68 00:03:29,190 --> 00:03:35,129 caliphates and in the ottoman period 69 00:03:31,650 --> 00:03:38,099 which occurred after the arab caliphate 70 00:03:35,129 --> 00:03:40,829 was conquered by the Ottoman Turks Iraq 71 00:03:38,099 --> 00:03:44,310 was divided into three provinces that 72 00:03:40,829 --> 00:03:46,829 remain very crucial to the understanding 73 00:03:44,310 --> 00:03:48,900 of the modern state there was the vill 74 00:03:46,829 --> 00:03:52,109 yet that's the Ottoman word for province 75 00:03:48,900 --> 00:03:55,169 of Mosul in the north of Baghdad in the 76 00:03:52,109 --> 00:03:57,599 middle and of Basra in the South three 77 00:03:55,169 --> 00:04:00,989 cities that appear as much if not more 78 00:03:57,599 --> 00:04:03,690 so in the newspapers and websites of a 79 00:04:00,989 --> 00:04:06,440 news orientation in the 21st century and 80 00:04:03,690 --> 00:04:10,319 who surely is it not the case that the 81 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:13,799 area now known as Kuwait was a part of 82 00:04:10,319 --> 00:04:16,590 the Valaya of Basra therefore was Iraqi 83 00:04:13,799 --> 00:04:19,079 that's incredibly important to the 84 00:04:16,590 --> 00:04:22,200 modern history of the region and that 85 00:04:19,079 --> 00:04:25,830 indeed is absolutely truth now the 86 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:28,919 ottoman period lasted 400 years 87 00:04:25,830 --> 00:04:33,060 just over yet and the successor occupier 88 00:04:28,919 --> 00:04:35,460 was of course the British they saw of 89 00:04:33,060 --> 00:04:38,879 course the strategic importance of a 90 00:04:35,460 --> 00:04:42,330 country on the Persian Gulf they were 91 00:04:38,879 --> 00:04:45,449 beginning to see the importance of what 92 00:04:42,330 --> 00:04:51,210 looked like a healthy reserve of black 93 00:04:45,449 --> 00:04:54,030 gold oil underneath Iraq but also and 94 00:04:51,210 --> 00:04:57,020 perhaps predominantly the British 95 00:04:54,030 --> 00:05:01,020 regarded their our Mesopotamia colonial 96 00:04:57,020 --> 00:05:04,500 possession as part of their historic 97 00:05:01,020 --> 00:05:07,469 obsession of protecting the approaches 98 00:05:04,500 --> 00:05:10,710 to India which was the jewel in the 99 00:05:07,469 --> 00:05:13,129 British Empire's crown absolutely it was 100 00:05:10,710 --> 00:05:16,400 thought at the time that any strategic 101 00:05:13,129 --> 00:05:19,379 location on the crux of the wider 102 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:22,229 crescent-shaped door to the subcontinent 103 00:05:19,379 --> 00:05:24,960 which frankly goes from the Caspian down 104 00:05:22,229 --> 00:05:27,960 to the Gulf of Oman needs to be a 105 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:30,690 bulwark of Britain this explains British 106 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:34,289 aggression towards Iran there was a coup 107 00:05:30,690 --> 00:05:36,599 a British coup in 1925 which was less 108 00:05:34,289 --> 00:05:40,500 famous than another British American 109 00:05:36,599 --> 00:05:43,020 coup in 1953 it explains why during the 110 00:05:40,500 --> 00:05:45,479 late 19th century the so-called great 111 00:05:43,020 --> 00:05:48,240 game period there were fears of Russia 112 00:05:45,479 --> 00:05:50,639 going from the Black Sea into regions 113 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:53,190 further south both in terms of Western 114 00:05:50,639 --> 00:05:55,050 Eurasia that's who we see Britain and 115 00:05:53,190 --> 00:05:57,839 France provoking wars between Russia and 116 00:05:55,050 --> 00:06:00,529 Turkey and also closer to this mouth to 117 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:03,180 the Indian subcontinent which which 118 00:06:00,529 --> 00:06:07,110 developed into the lost great Russian 119 00:06:03,180 --> 00:06:10,349 war with Persia in 1828 and all of this 120 00:06:07,110 --> 00:06:12,900 the north eastern end of the Arab world 121 00:06:10,349 --> 00:06:15,509 the geographical cultural and historical 122 00:06:12,900 --> 00:06:18,060 Arab space which Iraq is a central part 123 00:06:15,509 --> 00:06:20,879 of this has always been an area that's 124 00:06:18,060 --> 00:06:23,639 been highly desired by Western colonial 125 00:06:20,879 --> 00:06:26,550 factions who want to have a safe passage 126 00:06:23,639 --> 00:06:29,610 from Southern and Eastern Europe into 127 00:06:26,550 --> 00:06:34,550 South Asia the First World War of course 128 00:06:29,610 --> 00:06:37,110 was fiercely fought in Mesopotamia the 129 00:06:34,550 --> 00:06:40,860 Turkish forces 130 00:06:37,110 --> 00:06:44,009 fought far more successfully than had 131 00:06:40,860 --> 00:06:49,470 been imagined before they entered the 132 00:06:44,009 --> 00:06:52,520 war it's not very much understood that 133 00:06:49,470 --> 00:06:56,610 Iraq let's call it by a shorter name now 134 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:59,039 Iraq was a part of the Indian Empire the 135 00:06:56,610 --> 00:07:01,830 British Indian empire was governed from 136 00:06:59,039 --> 00:07:06,150 the India office not the Arab office in 137 00:07:01,830 --> 00:07:10,650 Cairo and the huge casualties suffered 138 00:07:06,150 --> 00:07:14,490 by the British forces in Iraq were 139 00:07:10,650 --> 00:07:17,639 almost all Indian soldiers undivided 140 00:07:14,490 --> 00:07:22,919 India yes India Pakistan Bangladesh even 141 00:07:17,639 --> 00:07:26,219 Burma they lost tens of thousands of men 142 00:07:22,919 --> 00:07:28,500 in places like cooked for example in the 143 00:07:26,219 --> 00:07:31,620 long siege and then the bloody aftermath 144 00:07:28,500 --> 00:07:33,569 of that siege it was one of the most 145 00:07:31,620 --> 00:07:36,419 extraordinary focal points of the 146 00:07:33,569 --> 00:07:38,780 so-called Eastern Front of the war and 147 00:07:36,419 --> 00:07:41,960 of course afterwards even though 148 00:07:38,780 --> 00:07:45,419 tactically the Turks fought very 149 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:48,690 valiantly in Iraq after the war because 150 00:07:45,419 --> 00:07:50,610 Turkey as a whole was vanquished we see 151 00:07:48,690 --> 00:07:52,889 two names who I think we're going to see 152 00:07:50,610 --> 00:07:55,289 and hear for that matter a lot in this 153 00:07:52,889 --> 00:07:57,990 series and that's the name of mr. Sykes 154 00:07:55,289 --> 00:08:00,840 from England and mr. picot from France 155 00:07:57,990 --> 00:08:03,330 who after it became clear that the 156 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:05,669 Ottoman Empire one way or another was 157 00:08:03,330 --> 00:08:08,340 going to disappear as a political entity 158 00:08:05,669 --> 00:08:10,560 in the Arab world the Arab world was 159 00:08:08,340 --> 00:08:15,870 divided much the way that someone would 160 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:17,430 divide a pie well I saw I was a member 161 00:08:15,870 --> 00:08:20,370 of the British Parliament as you know 162 00:08:17,430 --> 00:08:23,819 for almost 30 years and I used to walk 163 00:08:20,370 --> 00:08:27,060 past everyday the room in Parliament in 164 00:08:23,819 --> 00:08:30,389 which mr. Sykes and mr. picot the 165 00:08:27,060 --> 00:08:33,089 English and French statesman they would 166 00:08:30,389 --> 00:08:36,180 have called them at the time responsible 167 00:08:33,089 --> 00:08:39,570 for this division of the pie it's quite 168 00:08:36,180 --> 00:08:42,479 crucial to understand first of all this 169 00:08:39,570 --> 00:08:45,949 dichotomy between Cairo and the India 170 00:08:42,479 --> 00:08:50,410 office in terms of the British Empire 171 00:08:45,949 --> 00:08:54,300 but also the perfidious nature 172 00:08:50,410 --> 00:08:59,019 of Albion then some would say as now 173 00:08:54,300 --> 00:09:02,259 because sykes-picot whereas you say in 174 00:08:59,019 --> 00:09:04,089 that room dividing up the pie between 175 00:09:02,259 --> 00:09:09,120 Britain and France but they were doing 176 00:09:04,089 --> 00:09:12,850 so entirely in secret so they were 177 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:15,730 deceiving their Arab partners in the war 178 00:09:12,850 --> 00:09:19,629 against the Ottomans in the first world 179 00:09:15,730 --> 00:09:23,290 war the Cairo office Lawrence of Arabia 180 00:09:19,629 --> 00:09:27,040 and others were promising the Arab 181 00:09:23,290 --> 00:09:30,910 uprising one thing if the British should 182 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:34,199 be victorious in the war Sykes was 183 00:09:30,910 --> 00:09:38,490 promising picot something different and 184 00:09:34,199 --> 00:09:42,430 they were doing things in the 185 00:09:38,490 --> 00:09:45,160 Mesopotamia region that even other 186 00:09:42,430 --> 00:09:47,800 British officials in Cairo didn't know 187 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:51,990 let alone their French Imperial partners 188 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:55,720 it's a really classic example of the 189 00:09:51,990 --> 00:09:58,630 two-facedness of British Imperial policy 190 00:09:55,720 --> 00:10:00,899 was it not absolutely because the Cairo 191 00:09:58,630 --> 00:10:04,509 office is where the so-called British 192 00:10:00,899 --> 00:10:07,060 Arabists were and this isn't Arabist as 193 00:10:04,509 --> 00:10:08,980 in Arab nationalists as in NASA only 194 00:10:07,060 --> 00:10:11,319 shadow flock this is an Arab is desert 195 00:10:08,980 --> 00:10:13,439 in Englishmen concerned with conquering 196 00:10:11,319 --> 00:10:17,199 the Arab world meanwhile the 197 00:10:13,439 --> 00:10:19,959 Orientalists were sitting in Bombay and 198 00:10:17,199 --> 00:10:22,329 elsewhere throughout India Calcutta all 199 00:10:19,959 --> 00:10:24,790 the great centers of well great the 200 00:10:22,329 --> 00:10:27,009 centers of rule in the subcontinent we 201 00:10:24,790 --> 00:10:29,589 configured Karachi as well another great 202 00:10:27,009 --> 00:10:32,670 Center and they saw the Arab world 203 00:10:29,589 --> 00:10:35,589 merely in terms of material and 204 00:10:32,670 --> 00:10:39,459 geographic strategy where they didn't 205 00:10:35,589 --> 00:10:41,980 even care to create a deceptive dialogue 206 00:10:39,459 --> 00:10:44,559 the way that the progeny of Sykes in 207 00:10:41,980 --> 00:10:48,339 Pico did once they got the wire in at 208 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:51,160 the office in McMahon and in Cairo was 209 00:10:48,339 --> 00:10:54,129 communicating with Hussein from the 210 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:56,889 Hashemite family a series of messages 211 00:10:54,129 --> 00:10:59,620 which were clearly enough that the 212 00:10:56,889 --> 00:11:02,230 British would favor our United and 213 00:10:59,620 --> 00:11:04,720 independent Arab world 214 00:11:02,230 --> 00:11:06,640 should the Ottomans be defeated but that 215 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,920 wasn't what the British intended at all 216 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:11,710 it was possibly one of the biggest lies 217 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:14,620 ever told certainly in the 20th century 218 00:11:11,710 --> 00:11:17,320 while Lawrence was leading the so-called 219 00:11:14,620 --> 00:11:19,570 Arab revolt with the telegrams coming in 220 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,880 from Cairo that there would be a single 221 00:11:19,570 --> 00:11:24,520 United Arab world as there was under the 222 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:26,770 Turks but importantly for the air the 223 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:29,110 proto Arab nationalist it would be under 224 00:11:26,770 --> 00:11:31,780 an Arab flag for the first time since 225 00:11:29,110 --> 00:11:34,000 the Caliphate of the Arabs was subsumed 226 00:11:31,780 --> 00:11:36,880 by the Caliphate of the Ottoman Turks 227 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:40,240 the opposite happened the Arab world 228 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:43,570 became more divided than in any time 229 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:46,120 before the very for ancient period 230 00:11:43,570 --> 00:11:48,790 talking about before Hammurabi and not 231 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:50,860 only that but everything was done for 232 00:11:48,790 --> 00:11:53,500 the advantage of Britain in France and 233 00:11:50,860 --> 00:11:55,540 later on the advantage of the Zionists 234 00:11:53,500 --> 00:11:57,970 rather than to the advantage of the 235 00:11:55,540 --> 00:11:59,860 Arabs themselves who wanted those two 236 00:11:57,970 --> 00:12:02,470 simple things that were falsely promised 237 00:11:59,860 --> 00:12:04,210 freedom in unity the First World War was 238 00:12:02,470 --> 00:12:06,720 amongst many other things that we have 239 00:12:04,210 --> 00:12:10,690 already discussed on the history boys 240 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:12,580 the dawning of the age of oil as king 241 00:12:10,690 --> 00:12:14,590 and by the end of the First World War 242 00:12:12,580 --> 00:12:19,960 the British were certainly keenly aware 243 00:12:14,590 --> 00:12:23,290 of the the oil reserves of Iraq and 244 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:27,550 indeed of Iran and elsewhere in the Gulf 245 00:12:23,290 --> 00:12:30,790 region they were determined therefore to 246 00:12:27,550 --> 00:12:34,450 keep hold of Iraq for many reasons not 247 00:12:30,790 --> 00:12:38,250 just the approaches to India argument 248 00:12:34,450 --> 00:12:42,220 and so they established didn't they 249 00:12:38,250 --> 00:12:46,480 Hashim I kingdoms there but if any of 250 00:12:42,220 --> 00:12:49,380 those as one did show any signs of 251 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:53,820 independence we were even ready to 252 00:12:49,380 --> 00:12:56,740 regicide we were even ready to kill 253 00:12:53,820 --> 00:12:59,560 Iraqi Kings we were determined that 254 00:12:56,740 --> 00:13:02,440 Iraqi leaders would be puppets of the 255 00:12:59,560 --> 00:13:04,810 British absolutely right there were 256 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:06,880 three original Hashemite kingdoms that 257 00:13:04,810 --> 00:13:09,040 the British gave and the Hashemite 258 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:11,410 family a very important family in the 259 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:14,860 region as they are the Sharifs of Mecca 260 00:13:11,410 --> 00:13:15,500 the guardians of the most holy city in 261 00:13:14,860 --> 00:13:18,140 the air 262 00:13:15,500 --> 00:13:20,360 in all of Islam these three kingdoms 263 00:13:18,140 --> 00:13:22,810 were the kingdom of the hedges in the 264 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:25,010 western part of the arabian peninsula 265 00:13:22,810 --> 00:13:28,250 Transjordan which was later shortened to 266 00:13:25,010 --> 00:13:30,980 jordan and ironically syria which was 267 00:13:28,250 --> 00:13:34,400 then swapped and the french took Syria 268 00:13:30,980 --> 00:13:36,170 and Britain put the Hashemite in Iraq we 269 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:38,450 can only imagine the reason for it it's 270 00:13:36,170 --> 00:13:41,390 an even shorter word than Iraq and it's 271 00:13:38,450 --> 00:13:43,550 oil so preferred yes Albion even had his 272 00:13:41,390 --> 00:13:45,350 way with the French but not so much as 273 00:13:43,550 --> 00:13:48,380 he had with the Arabs that were deceived 274 00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:50,510 now the he Joss was the first of these 275 00:13:48,380 --> 00:13:53,780 three kingdoms to go when in nineteen 276 00:13:50,510 --> 00:13:56,860 late 1924 the British switched sides 277 00:13:53,780 --> 00:13:59,780 from the respected Hashemite dynasty 278 00:13:56,860 --> 00:14:02,060 that actually was instrumental in 279 00:13:59,780 --> 00:14:04,250 organizing the Arabs during the Arab 280 00:14:02,060 --> 00:14:06,680 revolt and they gave it to a group of 281 00:14:04,250 --> 00:14:08,810 backwards people that on the Turkish 282 00:14:06,680 --> 00:14:12,170 maps was simply referred to as the 283 00:14:08,810 --> 00:14:14,000 Wahabis and they switched sides in the 284 00:14:12,170 --> 00:14:16,040 war between the Wahabis and the 285 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:20,150 Hashemites and this led to the creation 286 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:23,720 of Saudi Arabia after the family the 287 00:14:20,150 --> 00:14:27,260 leading family Al Saud indeed and this 288 00:14:23,720 --> 00:14:30,770 became effectively a state that was a 289 00:14:27,260 --> 00:14:32,840 kind of kleptocratic nepotistic pseudo 290 00:14:30,770 --> 00:14:36,200 British puppet state certainly before 291 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:39,260 the price of oil exponentially rose 292 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:42,110 later on in 1970 yes becoming 293 00:14:39,260 --> 00:14:46,490 effectively an American colony at bitter 294 00:14:42,110 --> 00:14:52,010 Lake when Roosevelt met the leader of 295 00:14:46,490 --> 00:14:57,560 the Al Saud King Abdulaziz but let's go 296 00:14:52,010 --> 00:15:03,880 back to Iraq when it was no longer 297 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:07,430 possible for royal personages - hold on 298 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:10,460 we were still determined one with there 299 00:15:07,430 --> 00:15:13,520 was a shadowy figure called Nuri side 300 00:15:10,460 --> 00:15:14,630 the only thing to say about him well he 301 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:17,060 was certainly one of the more 302 00:15:14,630 --> 00:15:19,670 controversial figures in all of this and 303 00:15:17,060 --> 00:15:22,970 to just sort of broaden the lens of it 304 00:15:19,670 --> 00:15:25,540 to talk about Iraq's transition from a 305 00:15:22,970 --> 00:15:29,390 monarchy to a republic we have to go to 306 00:15:25,540 --> 00:15:33,020 1958 when a man called Qasim B 307 00:15:29,390 --> 00:15:35,180 came the leader of Iraq now this worried 308 00:15:33,020 --> 00:15:37,430 the British a great deal they thought he 309 00:15:35,180 --> 00:15:39,700 was a communist and too close to the 310 00:15:37,430 --> 00:15:42,650 Soviet and he certainly had many 311 00:15:39,700 --> 00:15:44,930 alliances with the Communist Party of 312 00:15:42,650 --> 00:15:47,810 Iraq but he wasn't at all as close to 313 00:15:44,930 --> 00:15:51,050 the Soviet Union as he was suspected of 314 00:15:47,810 --> 00:15:52,280 being that's not untypical in the 315 00:15:51,050 --> 00:15:56,000 postwar period 316 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:58,700 you only had to not hate the Soviet 317 00:15:56,000 --> 00:16:01,850 Union to be suspected of being an agent 318 00:15:58,700 --> 00:16:03,680 of the Soviet Union never never true is 319 00:16:01,850 --> 00:16:07,100 our strategic words spoken the night 320 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:10,280 yeah Abdul Karim Qasim is still revered 321 00:16:07,100 --> 00:16:13,430 by some people in Iraq he was an Arab 322 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:18,470 nationalist leader you might say he was 323 00:16:13,430 --> 00:16:23,030 an early NASA but he was overthrown then 324 00:16:18,470 --> 00:16:25,490 in his in 1963 by a coup involving 325 00:16:23,030 --> 00:16:29,720 appearing now on our stage for the first 326 00:16:25,490 --> 00:16:33,620 time the Baath Party except at that time 327 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:36,140 and once or twice subsequently the bath 328 00:16:33,620 --> 00:16:39,320 party was in alliance with the British 329 00:16:36,140 --> 00:16:41,960 and the Americans to overthrow Qasim 330 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:43,820 it was a very peculiar set of 331 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:45,920 relationships this was what both is 332 00:16:43,820 --> 00:16:49,100 called the Ramadan revolution where 333 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:51,920 Qasim was executed and the reasons for 334 00:16:49,100 --> 00:16:54,830 this are many Qasim was very close to 335 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:56,990 leftist factions in Iraq the Baathists 336 00:16:54,830 --> 00:16:59,210 were leftist one would think this 337 00:16:56,990 --> 00:17:00,920 wouldn't be a problem and the Arab world 338 00:16:59,210 --> 00:17:03,290 as it is in so many other nations 339 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:05,480 struggling for independence it is and 340 00:17:03,290 --> 00:17:07,370 for the following reason narcissism of 341 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:09,440 the small difference as March would put 342 00:17:07,370 --> 00:17:13,100 it very much so 343 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:16,010 Qasim was very much in Iraqi nationalist 344 00:17:13,100 --> 00:17:18,410 so much so that the Arab nationalists in 345 00:17:16,010 --> 00:17:22,370 the Baath Party who favored a more pan 346 00:17:18,410 --> 00:17:24,530 Arab East style ethos of NASA and of 347 00:17:22,370 --> 00:17:27,079 mashaallah flock they said that this man 348 00:17:24,530 --> 00:17:29,750 is getting too close to some of the non 349 00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:33,020 Arab minorities on the fringes of Iraqi 350 00:17:29,750 --> 00:17:35,300 society in a geographical sense and one 351 00:17:33,020 --> 00:17:37,400 peculiar feature about communist parties 352 00:17:35,300 --> 00:17:40,040 in the Arab world is they don't use the 353 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:42,590 language of Arab nationalism in ways 354 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:45,230 which tended to resonate with other 355 00:17:42,590 --> 00:17:47,059 Arab nationalists so and and there's 356 00:17:45,230 --> 00:17:48,830 quite a lot to that because while they 357 00:17:47,059 --> 00:17:51,200 were talking about the fraternal 358 00:17:48,830 --> 00:17:53,210 Brotherhood of mankind using Soviet 359 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:56,029 language the Baathists like the 360 00:17:53,210 --> 00:17:58,640 Nazareth's spoke more directly to at 361 00:17:56,029 --> 00:18:00,440 least a large proportion of the Arabs 362 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:04,130 the Arab communists were compromised 363 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:07,760 also by the important role played by the 364 00:18:04,130 --> 00:18:10,850 Soviet Union in the birth of Israel very 365 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:12,710 much so people tend to forget that well 366 00:18:10,850 --> 00:18:15,890 Vladimir Putin is certainly more 367 00:18:12,710 --> 00:18:18,649 pro-israel than Brezhnev that the most 368 00:18:15,890 --> 00:18:20,480 pro-israel Soviet leader in history up 369 00:18:18,649 --> 00:18:24,169 to the time of his death was none other 370 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:26,330 than Stalin and this is a fact that sort 371 00:18:24,169 --> 00:18:28,700 of erased from history because of how 372 00:18:26,330 --> 00:18:32,299 after 56 and I think much more 373 00:18:28,700 --> 00:18:34,250 importantly after 67 the Soviet Union 374 00:18:32,299 --> 00:18:36,890 became very much pro-arab 375 00:18:34,250 --> 00:18:40,820 very much for the Palestinian cause but 376 00:18:36,890 --> 00:18:43,580 at the beginning Stalin saw Israel as a 377 00:18:40,820 --> 00:18:45,770 place where he could spread communism 378 00:18:43,580 --> 00:18:48,380 very easily in the Middle East because 379 00:18:45,770 --> 00:18:51,320 certainly the European Jews who became 380 00:18:48,380 --> 00:18:53,090 the Zionists of Palestine were people 381 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:56,299 exposed to more communist literature 382 00:18:53,090 --> 00:18:58,130 than the Arabs of Iraq which or Syria or 383 00:18:56,299 --> 00:19:00,620 Palestine which had a very different 384 00:18:58,130 --> 00:19:02,690 tradition and many would say that 385 00:19:00,620 --> 00:19:05,179 Russia's very close relationship with 386 00:19:02,690 --> 00:19:07,190 Tel Aviv today is based on a similar 387 00:19:05,179 --> 00:19:10,220 strategy just to race the word socialism 388 00:19:07,190 --> 00:19:15,110 or communism so the bath is somehow in 389 00:19:10,220 --> 00:19:19,370 power in 1963 a man called Saddam 390 00:19:15,110 --> 00:19:22,640 Hussein was a young a junior actor in 391 00:19:19,370 --> 00:19:24,440 the event so his 1963 but he becomes 392 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:27,919 much more important later doesn't he 393 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:29,809 indeed a quick your phrase about those 394 00:19:27,919 --> 00:19:32,450 who are the most similar quarreling the 395 00:19:29,809 --> 00:19:34,070 most in November of 63 the Baathists 396 00:19:32,450 --> 00:19:36,860 were overthrown by their own allies 397 00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:39,080 because there was a thought that they 398 00:19:36,860 --> 00:19:41,799 weren't being nasara snuff and wanting 399 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:43,850 to unite with Syria and with Egypt 400 00:19:41,799 --> 00:19:47,630 incidentally Syria had about this 401 00:19:43,850 --> 00:19:50,210 revolution in 63 as well in 66 the 402 00:19:47,630 --> 00:19:54,919 possibilities split and I just get this 403 00:19:50,210 --> 00:19:56,460 right the Baathists whose raison d'etre 404 00:19:54,919 --> 00:20:00,390 was to unite the Arab 405 00:19:56,460 --> 00:20:02,100 world couldn't even unite two countries 406 00:20:00,390 --> 00:20:04,230 next door to each other when they were 407 00:20:02,100 --> 00:20:06,270 in power in both countries first the 408 00:20:04,230 --> 00:20:09,060 Baathists fell out with each other in 409 00:20:06,270 --> 00:20:11,760 Iraq and then the Iraqi bosses and the 410 00:20:09,060 --> 00:20:13,410 Syrian Balthus fell out in 66 how 411 00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:16,500 different things would have been if they 412 00:20:13,410 --> 00:20:18,630 had lived up to a flex idea of our Abuna 413 00:20:16,500 --> 00:20:21,090 tea well the Arab world if it were a 414 00:20:18,630 --> 00:20:23,610 united arab republic or a united arab 415 00:20:21,090 --> 00:20:25,470 confederation would be I think the 416 00:20:23,610 --> 00:20:28,350 biggest state in the world after China 417 00:20:25,470 --> 00:20:31,170 and India with all the oil that goes 418 00:20:28,350 --> 00:20:34,650 with it and great seaports and great 419 00:20:31,170 --> 00:20:38,700 whether it would be a superpower so this 420 00:20:34,650 --> 00:20:41,640 petty arguing over inexplicably petty 421 00:20:38,700 --> 00:20:43,710 political rivalries has turned an Arab 422 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:45,780 world that could have been a superpower 423 00:20:43,710 --> 00:20:48,840 on the level of the US Russia and China 424 00:20:45,780 --> 00:20:50,820 into a place where the superpowers play 425 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:54,420 football with people's economy is no 426 00:20:50,820 --> 00:20:56,760 idea how sad as some 140 years and more 427 00:20:54,420 --> 00:20:59,940 in the Arab world myself how sad that 428 00:20:56,760 --> 00:21:03,680 makes me feel but well expressed 429 00:20:59,940 --> 00:21:07,920 so the Baathists come back to power and 430 00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:10,110 Saddam Hussein is the strongman vice 431 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:13,770 president they used to call him at the 432 00:21:10,110 --> 00:21:17,190 time ultimately becoming the president 433 00:21:13,770 --> 00:21:21,270 the 70s were something of a golden age 434 00:21:17,190 --> 00:21:23,580 for the Iraqis and for the bath one day 435 00:21:21,270 --> 00:21:26,040 they certainly were the president at the 436 00:21:23,580 --> 00:21:28,800 time whose name is forgotten because of 437 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:31,410 Saddam's more controversial to put it 438 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:34,410 mildly legacy it was a man called Ahmad 439 00:21:31,410 --> 00:21:37,740 Hassan al-bakr and this was an error in 440 00:21:34,410 --> 00:21:39,990 the 70s where a combination of a long 441 00:21:37,740 --> 00:21:43,350 lost and organized central government 442 00:21:39,990 --> 00:21:45,030 plus rising oil prices it emancipated 443 00:21:43,350 --> 00:21:48,390 the government emancipated women 444 00:21:45,030 --> 00:21:51,510 educated them infrastructure was being 445 00:21:48,390 --> 00:21:54,480 built people were driving cause Iraq was 446 00:21:51,510 --> 00:21:56,520 a good place to be for an Iraqi has the 447 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:58,500 highest number of PhDs of any Arab 448 00:21:56,520 --> 00:22:00,960 country we're sending them all over the 449 00:21:58,500 --> 00:22:05,220 world many people watching this will 450 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:07,590 have met some of those Iraq bill 451 00:22:05,220 --> 00:22:11,880 powerful army about which 452 00:22:07,590 --> 00:22:13,919 or later had a science base that's why 453 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:17,039 the whole canard about weapons of mass 454 00:22:13,919 --> 00:22:19,320 destruction and so on could fly in the 455 00:22:17,039 --> 00:22:24,000 first place even though by the time it 456 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:29,539 was used it was a fake a fake cannot as 457 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:34,049 a kebab has to be the science base of 458 00:22:29,539 --> 00:22:39,840 Baathist Iraq the education base the 459 00:22:34,049 --> 00:22:42,899 position of women it was the Acme of 460 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:45,179 modernity in the Arab world it certainly 461 00:22:42,899 --> 00:22:47,700 was living standards were incredibly 462 00:22:45,179 --> 00:22:50,549 high as they should have been the idea 463 00:22:47,700 --> 00:22:53,250 that the Iraq we see today as a poor 464 00:22:50,549 --> 00:22:54,960 country as a broken country Iraq could 465 00:22:53,250 --> 00:22:57,419 be one of the wealthiest countries in 466 00:22:54,960 --> 00:23:00,120 the world and in the 1970s it was 467 00:22:57,419 --> 00:23:03,809 certainly on the way the Hanging Gardens 468 00:23:00,120 --> 00:23:07,020 of Babylon that long disappeared figment 469 00:23:03,809 --> 00:23:09,539 of ancient law was on the road to being 470 00:23:07,020 --> 00:23:11,940 rebuilt under our backers government in 471 00:23:09,539 --> 00:23:15,630 the seventies all the more peculiar then 472 00:23:11,940 --> 00:23:18,570 that the Iraqi regime allowed itself 473 00:23:15,630 --> 00:23:22,679 this is at least my interpretation to be 474 00:23:18,570 --> 00:23:25,640 seduced by its own enemies in its own 475 00:23:22,679 --> 00:23:28,409 area in the Arab world and by the 476 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:34,159 imperialist powers to launch an attack 477 00:23:28,409 --> 00:23:37,559 on Iran because they altogether feared 478 00:23:34,159 --> 00:23:40,679 home any and the Islamic Revolution in 479 00:23:37,559 --> 00:23:43,230 Iran indeed and this was under Saddam 480 00:23:40,679 --> 00:23:44,909 another element that half of this story 481 00:23:43,230 --> 00:23:47,220 that happened just before the first 482 00:23:44,909 --> 00:23:50,640 salvors were fought were fired in the 483 00:23:47,220 --> 00:23:53,279 Iranian Iraq war was this in Alberta's 484 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:57,090 last years of power he was working to 485 00:23:53,279 --> 00:24:00,000 reconcile with Syria and unite the two 486 00:23:57,090 --> 00:24:02,730 countries this vote was very unpopular 487 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:04,980 with Saddam for the simple reason that 488 00:24:02,730 --> 00:24:07,440 Hafez al Assad the then President of 489 00:24:04,980 --> 00:24:10,590 Syria being the older of the two men 490 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:13,200 would have perhaps being the leading man 491 00:24:10,590 --> 00:24:16,110 of the Alliance so Saddam famously 492 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:19,080 purged his own Politburo of those 493 00:24:16,110 --> 00:24:19,870 suspected rightly or wrongly of being 494 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:23,020 Pro 495 00:24:19,870 --> 00:24:25,480 with Syria he then consoled some of them 496 00:24:23,020 --> 00:24:28,120 with his own hand very it was one of the 497 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:30,700 most dramatic moments certainly that 498 00:24:28,120 --> 00:24:33,730 gave Saddam the reputation internally 499 00:24:30,700 --> 00:24:36,040 certainly that he continued to have the 500 00:24:33,730 --> 00:24:38,830 iran-iraq war was a disaster 501 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:42,130 and it was an unnecessary disaster the 502 00:24:38,830 --> 00:24:44,770 rhetoric about Iran exporting its style 503 00:24:42,130 --> 00:24:47,200 of Islamic Revolution was much like that 504 00:24:44,770 --> 00:24:49,360 spread by many others it shouldn't have 505 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:51,040 been taken seriously but some in the 506 00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:53,110 Arab world especially in the secular 507 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:56,200 Baathist Arab world did take it 508 00:24:53,110 --> 00:24:59,920 seriously especially in sin in Iraq 509 00:24:56,200 --> 00:25:01,210 which had a a multi-ethnic a name and 510 00:24:59,920 --> 00:25:02,950 more importantly a multi-religious 511 00:25:01,210 --> 00:25:05,230 government I should say it wasn't all 512 00:25:02,950 --> 00:25:08,230 Sunnis ruling over a majority Shia 513 00:25:05,230 --> 00:25:11,230 population as the rumor goes in the same 514 00:25:08,230 --> 00:25:13,660 way that Syria isn't Alawite Shia ruling 515 00:25:11,230 --> 00:25:14,860 over a majority Sunni population as the 516 00:25:13,660 --> 00:25:18,610 rumor goes quite so 517 00:25:14,860 --> 00:25:23,050 so Iraq on the face of it wins the 518 00:25:18,610 --> 00:25:27,059 iran-iraq war though wins it a very 519 00:25:23,050 --> 00:25:32,200 great cost yes not the least of the cost 520 00:25:27,059 --> 00:25:35,050 being that the conservative kingdoms 521 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:38,410 around it who would put huge amounts of 522 00:25:35,050 --> 00:25:42,010 money into the Iraq war effort they 523 00:25:38,410 --> 00:25:44,070 declared particularly Kuwait that these 524 00:25:42,010 --> 00:25:47,530 were not grants there were loans and 525 00:25:44,070 --> 00:25:51,940 Kuwait wanted the money back this 526 00:25:47,530 --> 00:25:55,630 excited an antipathy towards Kuwait 527 00:25:51,940 --> 00:26:00,250 which led to an even bigger blunder by 528 00:25:55,630 --> 00:26:03,640 Saddam namely the attempt to bring back 529 00:26:00,250 --> 00:26:07,630 into Iraq the Kuwait which had been 530 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:10,390 stolen from her by imperialism yes this 531 00:26:07,630 --> 00:26:13,480 was in the late 80s and early 90s Kuwait 532 00:26:10,390 --> 00:26:15,490 was also accused of slant oil drilling 533 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,530 meaning the pipe is pounded into the 534 00:26:15,490 --> 00:26:19,570 ground so to speak in Kuwait but it has 535 00:26:17,530 --> 00:26:22,690 a little fulcrum and it goes under the 536 00:26:19,570 --> 00:26:25,840 ground into bars almost under - actually 537 00:26:22,690 --> 00:26:28,240 indeed and this was the beginning of the 538 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:30,310 Gulf War and it was a very inauspicious 539 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,710 beginning in many ways because we have 540 00:26:30,310 --> 00:26:33,430 to remember in the 1980s Saddam was a 541 00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:36,100 friend 542 00:26:33,430 --> 00:26:39,460 of the Soviet Union and a friend of the 543 00:26:36,100 --> 00:26:41,620 NATO powers namely the United States and 544 00:26:39,460 --> 00:26:43,990 we also can't forget that at the same 545 00:26:41,620 --> 00:26:46,810 time Ronald Reagan was selling money to 546 00:26:43,990 --> 00:26:50,440 the Iranians in order to filter the 547 00:26:46,810 --> 00:26:53,350 money to the right-wing Sandinistas in 548 00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:55,420 Nicaragua making matters even weirder 549 00:26:53,350 --> 00:26:57,700 it's said even though it's ferociously 550 00:26:55,420 --> 00:27:00,580 denied by tape Iran that Israel 551 00:26:57,700 --> 00:27:03,130 America's best buddy in the region was 552 00:27:00,580 --> 00:27:04,870 arming the Iranians because at that time 553 00:27:03,130 --> 00:27:06,670 they were more afraid of an Arab 554 00:27:04,870 --> 00:27:08,950 nationalist with a strong military like 555 00:27:06,670 --> 00:27:11,650 Saddam than they were afraid of Khomeini 556 00:27:08,950 --> 00:27:15,070 and the Islamic Revolution you couldn't 557 00:27:11,650 --> 00:27:18,130 make it up except it's history great is 558 00:27:15,070 --> 00:27:20,740 recovered by the imperial powers the 559 00:27:18,130 --> 00:27:25,000 Kuwaiti rulers having all run away no 560 00:27:20,740 --> 00:27:28,780 resistance there but inevitably it was 561 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:32,860 taken back and the longest and darkest 562 00:27:28,780 --> 00:27:35,740 night for Iraq ensued I myself was a 563 00:27:32,860 --> 00:27:41,080 regular visitor to Iraq at that time 564 00:27:35,740 --> 00:27:46,060 after 93 I was there doesent scores of 565 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:48,490 times Iraq under sanctions was not the 566 00:27:46,060 --> 00:27:52,030 Hanging Gardens of Babylon but there 567 00:27:48,490 --> 00:27:55,600 were a lot of metaphorically speaking 568 00:27:52,030 --> 00:27:58,990 hanging children who were dying like 569 00:27:55,600 --> 00:28:01,840 flies under the most brutal siege 570 00:27:58,990 --> 00:28:04,960 conditions imposed by the so-called 571 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:07,450 civilized world in what became known as 572 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:10,000 the rocky sanctions though sanctions 573 00:28:07,450 --> 00:28:13,920 doesn't actually do justice to what 574 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:21,150 happened the Iraqis were systematically 575 00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:24,570 starved and effectively a genocide began 576 00:28:21,150 --> 00:28:27,310 particularly of the youngest Iraqis 577 00:28:24,570 --> 00:28:30,870 hundreds and hundreds of thousands of 578 00:28:27,310 --> 00:28:34,210 children dying because of sanctions and 579 00:28:30,870 --> 00:28:37,210 your journey into Iraq in the 90s was of 580 00:28:34,210 --> 00:28:39,460 course to try to reverse history what 581 00:28:37,210 --> 00:28:41,950 was it particularly that brought you to 582 00:28:39,460 --> 00:28:43,960 Iraq at this most desperate time up 583 00:28:41,950 --> 00:28:45,330 until then you are in Iran you know it's 584 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:48,870 funny you ask that because 585 00:28:45,330 --> 00:28:51,020 I had never been in Iraq before 1993 and 586 00:28:48,870 --> 00:28:54,840 I wouldn't have been welcome if I had 587 00:28:51,020 --> 00:28:58,260 first because I was associated in 588 00:28:54,840 --> 00:29:00,990 earlier days with the leftists in Iraq 589 00:28:58,260 --> 00:29:05,070 who have been driven out of the country 590 00:29:00,990 --> 00:29:08,450 and then because in the iraq-iran war I 591 00:29:05,070 --> 00:29:11,370 had effectively supported Iran on the 592 00:29:08,450 --> 00:29:12,480 basis that I knew that this was a 593 00:29:11,370 --> 00:29:17,070 disaster 594 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:20,460 for Iraq and for Iran and that had been 595 00:29:17,070 --> 00:29:23,400 done at the behest of the very worst 596 00:29:20,460 --> 00:29:27,960 people in the imperialist world and in 597 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:31,860 the Arab world but in 1993 I could 598 00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:34,530 already smell the suffering of the Iraqi 599 00:29:31,860 --> 00:29:38,040 people and I went there and touched it 600 00:29:34,530 --> 00:29:40,920 and at that point Iraq entered my 601 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:44,780 bloodstream and that has never left it 602 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:47,850 indeed so close to Iraq did I become 603 00:29:44,780 --> 00:29:50,640 when I would hear someone say the word 604 00:29:47,850 --> 00:29:57,110 Iraq I would turn as if they'd called my 605 00:29:50,640 --> 00:30:02,310 name so deeply was I involved from 93 606 00:29:57,110 --> 00:30:06,420 until 2003 in the issue of Iraq indeed 607 00:30:02,310 --> 00:30:09,420 you could say Iraq has not just changed 608 00:30:06,420 --> 00:30:12,290 but dominated my life ever since because 609 00:30:09,420 --> 00:30:16,530 I paid quite a high political price for 610 00:30:12,290 --> 00:30:20,070 my stand with Iraq it said that the 611 00:30:16,530 --> 00:30:23,250 Iraqis are good friends and bad enemies 612 00:30:20,070 --> 00:30:25,820 and I think that's true from my point of 613 00:30:23,250 --> 00:30:29,090 view this is a controversial point 614 00:30:25,820 --> 00:30:32,640 Iraqis are the best of the Arabs 615 00:30:29,090 --> 00:30:35,130 certainly I saw the best of them because 616 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:37,860 I was their friend I was a very good 617 00:30:35,130 --> 00:30:41,280 friend and they were very good friends 618 00:30:37,860 --> 00:30:44,430 to me and there is simply heartbreaking 619 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:47,700 to me that we failed to stop the war 620 00:30:44,430 --> 00:30:49,850 which then destroyed Iraq do you share 621 00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:52,770 my view that they will never again be a 622 00:30:49,850 --> 00:30:55,920 single Iraq that will never again be an 623 00:30:52,770 --> 00:30:58,770 Iraq that even remotely approximates to 624 00:30:55,920 --> 00:31:01,740 that golden age in the 1970s that we 625 00:30:58,770 --> 00:31:04,380 disgust I'm incredibly pessimistic about 626 00:31:01,740 --> 00:31:08,220 it right now the u.s. appears to be 627 00:31:04,380 --> 00:31:10,710 using Basra in southern Iraq as a place 628 00:31:08,220 --> 00:31:13,560 to launch another war against Iran only 629 00:31:10,710 --> 00:31:16,260 this time the ringleader of the aunty 630 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:19,380 Iranian movement is a Shia Arab which 631 00:31:16,260 --> 00:31:22,140 puts to rest this sectarian narrative 632 00:31:19,380 --> 00:31:24,360 this simplistic trichotomous narrative 633 00:31:22,140 --> 00:31:27,420 we heard about Iraq now speaking of 634 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:30,180 three I want to take you back to 2003 635 00:31:27,420 --> 00:31:31,920 possibly the most fateful year in the 636 00:31:30,180 --> 00:31:34,200 modern history of the Middle East the 637 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:36,690 most fateful year in your storied 638 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:39,300 political career you warned the world 639 00:31:36,690 --> 00:31:41,910 not to weld the world you want the US 640 00:31:39,300 --> 00:31:44,670 and UK and its fledgling little allies 641 00:31:41,910 --> 00:31:47,400 not to invade Iraq both within the House 642 00:31:44,670 --> 00:31:49,950 of Commons in London and on the streets 643 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:52,860 of London I'd like you to tell a bit 644 00:31:49,950 --> 00:31:54,930 more about well perhaps I can sum up by 645 00:31:52,860 --> 00:31:57,480 what has turned out to be the last 646 00:31:54,930 --> 00:32:00,720 conversation I ever had with Tony Blair 647 00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:03,150 as you know I currently made a movie 648 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:05,040 called the killings of Tony Blair it's 649 00:32:03,150 --> 00:32:07,080 available on Amazon I choose it's the 650 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:09,210 biography of that he doesn't want you to 651 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:12,870 see which is the ocean sea is the one he 652 00:32:09,210 --> 00:32:15,480 doesn't want you to see but in my last 653 00:32:12,870 --> 00:32:20,370 conversation with him I told him three 654 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:23,130 things first of all that the fall of 655 00:32:20,370 --> 00:32:25,830 Baghdad if you invade this was a couple 656 00:32:23,130 --> 00:32:28,020 of weeks before the war the fall of 657 00:32:25,830 --> 00:32:31,580 Baghdad will not be the beginning of the 658 00:32:28,020 --> 00:32:34,140 end just the end of the beginning 659 00:32:31,580 --> 00:32:36,750 secondly the Iraqis will fight you with 660 00:32:34,140 --> 00:32:40,200 their teeth if necessary until they have 661 00:32:36,750 --> 00:32:46,230 driven you from their land and thirdly 662 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:51,620 if you invade and occupy Iraq you will 663 00:32:46,230 --> 00:32:54,840 begin a cascade of fanatic extremism 664 00:32:51,620 --> 00:32:57,660 which will spread across the whole of 665 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:59,030 the Muslim world and which will we were 666 00:32:57,660 --> 00:33:02,310 standing in the houses of parliament 667 00:32:59,030 --> 00:33:04,020 which will one day be in this building 668 00:33:02,310 --> 00:33:06,590 looking for you and looking for me 669 00:33:04,020 --> 00:33:09,679 to kill 670 00:33:06,590 --> 00:33:13,970 I shrivel as I repeat it because all 671 00:33:09,679 --> 00:33:19,270 three of those predictions it's crystal 672 00:33:13,970 --> 00:33:21,710 clear came perfectly true if anything I 673 00:33:19,270 --> 00:33:26,000 underestimated the ghastliness 674 00:33:21,710 --> 00:33:30,730 of the third the cascade of extremism I 675 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:36,320 had in mind could not in my wildest 676 00:33:30,730 --> 00:33:42,830 nightmare have included Isis the heart 677 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:47,620 eating head-chopping fanatic barbarians 678 00:33:42,830 --> 00:33:50,330 who would end up not just in London and 679 00:33:47,620 --> 00:33:53,029 everywhere else in the world but 680 00:33:50,330 --> 00:33:57,169 literally inside the gates of the House 681 00:33:53,029 --> 00:34:01,399 of Commons and neither I nor Blair were 682 00:33:57,169 --> 00:34:04,100 butchered by a man with two swords but a 683 00:34:01,399 --> 00:34:07,039 police officer a friend of mine for many 684 00:34:04,100 --> 00:34:10,040 years that I spoke to every morning as I 685 00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:14,000 entered Parliament gave his life's blood 686 00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:17,200 at the hands of this extremist with two 687 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:21,080 swords the fall of Baghdad it's clear 688 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:24,669 was just the end of the beginning the 689 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:28,960 war would rage on and rages on still 690 00:34:24,669 --> 00:34:31,310 fifteen years after the invasion of Iraq 691 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:36,290 Iraq is still at war 692 00:34:31,310 --> 00:34:37,040 Syria's of war Libya's at war Yemen is 693 00:34:36,290 --> 00:34:40,730 at war 694 00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:44,500 Saudi Arabia is at war Civil War perhaps 695 00:34:40,730 --> 00:34:48,849 by the talisca war comes our youth and 696 00:34:44,500 --> 00:34:52,099 blood is running everywhere from from 697 00:34:48,849 --> 00:34:55,669 what we call the Far East through the 698 00:34:52,099 --> 00:35:00,470 Middle East and well into the West the 699 00:34:55,669 --> 00:35:05,089 streets of Paris London Berlin and other 700 00:35:00,470 --> 00:35:07,130 places can I bother you but can I just 701 00:35:05,089 --> 00:35:09,230 say speaking of the warnings you gave 702 00:35:07,130 --> 00:35:10,880 you you were talking about the warnings 703 00:35:09,230 --> 00:35:12,619 you gave in the British House of Commons 704 00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:14,960 in London but there was another famous 705 00:35:12,619 --> 00:35:17,420 place where you gave a warning a few 706 00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,349 years after and that was the US Senate 707 00:35:17,420 --> 00:35:21,200 now that V 708 00:35:18,349 --> 00:35:22,930 Theo has been seen so many times around 709 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:26,299 the world over a hundred million times 710 00:35:22,930 --> 00:35:28,970 yeah but what isn't so known about that 711 00:35:26,299 --> 00:35:30,289 event is where were you just before what 712 00:35:28,970 --> 00:35:32,569 was going through your head 713 00:35:30,289 --> 00:35:35,450 obviously you address the House of 714 00:35:32,569 --> 00:35:37,130 Commons scores of times hundreds of 715 00:35:35,450 --> 00:35:39,680 times throughout your life it's the 716 00:35:37,130 --> 00:35:41,930 first and last time that you address the 717 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:46,999 US Senate I'd love you to talk more 718 00:35:41,930 --> 00:35:50,089 about that the US Senate appearance was 719 00:35:46,999 --> 00:35:54,109 probably my finest hour probably my 720 00:35:50,089 --> 00:35:56,930 greatest day it brought me to the 721 00:35:54,109 --> 00:35:59,059 attention of very large number of people 722 00:35:56,930 --> 00:36:01,970 including in the United States and 723 00:35:59,059 --> 00:36:05,420 attention which I've managed to retain 724 00:36:01,970 --> 00:36:08,180 by and large I tried to put the 725 00:36:05,420 --> 00:36:11,269 Americans on trial they thought they 726 00:36:08,180 --> 00:36:14,809 were putting me on trial I tried and I 727 00:36:11,269 --> 00:36:18,079 think I succeeded in some measure in 728 00:36:14,809 --> 00:36:23,269 putting them in the dock rather than 729 00:36:18,079 --> 00:36:27,319 myself but I think and can take no 730 00:36:23,269 --> 00:36:30,229 pleasure from whatever great days I had 731 00:36:27,319 --> 00:36:34,779 in having been proved comprehensively 732 00:36:30,229 --> 00:36:39,349 right because the cost has been so 733 00:36:34,779 --> 00:36:43,249 catastrophic and the first cost and the 734 00:36:39,349 --> 00:36:45,739 worst cost has been paid by people I 735 00:36:43,249 --> 00:36:49,339 came to love and about whom I still 736 00:36:45,739 --> 00:36:51,829 dream the people of Iraq we've been 737 00:36:49,339 --> 00:36:54,200 there history boys I've been George 738 00:36:51,829 --> 00:36:57,519 Galloway I'm Adam Geary and we'll be 739 00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:57,519 back next week God willing 740 00:36:57,900 --> 00:37:02,750 [Music]